Messages

Have you heard anything more from Tormek support?

Ken

I can see where various methods would work, including calculators or the marker method.
We should keep in mind that this discussion is now centered around 15° leather knives. How frequently will most of us encounter these knives or similar ones?

For the majority of knives which we actually sharpen, I believe the 8 to 25 degrees per side scale of the KS-123 is sufficient. My question is how many knives have we sharpened in the last year which do not fall in this range?

I acknowledge that there are other types of knives which do not fall within the range of the KS-123. Knives like cleavers and Serbian chef knives come to mind. Given a typical busy sharpening schedule like a Saturday morning at a farmers market, how many of these knives would one typically expect? My second question would be, how do you presently sharpen them? The marker method or calculators will still work for these outliers. I am not writing from actual high volume experience, so please feel free to disagree with me.

Ken

John,

Your son's outstanding work speaks very well of both him and his inspiring coach. Well done!

Ken

I am curious. Why would one want to sharpen a knife with a total angle less than 16°?

Leather skiving knife is about 15 deg.

John,

Sometimes we move forward by looking backward and at other jigs. When the SVD-185 was first introduced, the jig setting scale only went to 5. This was not quite enough for the popular Ellsworth Grind with bowl gouges. I first encountered the fix for this in the excellent video (included in the Woodturner's Info Box) by Jeff Farris. Jeff added an additional stop "number 6" on the SVD-185. Tormek later redesigned the SVD-185 to included number 6.

I also found this PDF which explained hor Torngy Jansson (inventor of the Tormek) had first modified a SVD-185 for a customer. The PDF is linked here:

 http://www.woodwrecker.com/woodworking/how-to/EllsworthGrind.pdf

How does this relate to the 15° leather knife and the KS-123? Note the umber of microadjust turns and fractional turns to move one degree on the scale. Set the setting tool for 16° and remove it. Then adjust the microadjust by the predetermined number of turns.

The KS-123 is really designed primarily for kitchen knives. Thatdoes not mean that it can not also sharpen leather knives.

Ken

I am curious. Why would one want to sharpen a knife with a total angle less than 16°?

Ken

HP, you are correct. My ACC is in my basement workshop. The stairs are presently very difficult for me. I looked at the image of a bottle on the website using my magnifying glass. I thought the 250ml on the top line was the quantity in the bottle. I looked more closely after reading your reply and realized that all the lines were either 10ml (the amount of concentrate) or 250ml (the amount ot water).

So, the included single bottle is 150ml, the same size as is sold (in a two pack.

Ken

We often see ACC (Tormek Anti Corrosion Concentrate) described as "expensive". Sometimes this is even listed as a con in pro and con descriptions of diamond wheels.ñ What I have not seen is "expensive" explained in actual usage costs. Nor have I seen the full benefits of ACC included in these criticisms.

Here are my questions for those of you using diamond wheels and ACC:

Every new diamond wheel includes one 150ml bottle of ACC. At the recommended dilution of 1:25, and the T8 water trough holding 125ml of water and 5ml of ACC, this included bottle should ideally provide thirty fresh sharpening sessions. This number will be influenced both by any spillage and how often the diluted solution is reused. The question is, have you used the ACC enough to require purchasing more?

Approximately how many knives or tools will one bottle of ACC last the way you sharpen? Related to this, for those who sharpen professionally, how much revenue will this number of knives or tools produce?

I hope this topic will provide a better definition of what "expensive" is.

Ken

John, your point is noted, as well as your good overview. As the presenter is a hobbiest turner rather than a professional turner, I am inclined to overlook the misstep. I think his basic premise, that, for his needs, his basic grinder and included wheels were sufficient, is valid.

The sharpening community includes those of us with many sharpening "needs". Often those with simple needs may be overlooked.

Ken

PS I trust your son is doing well with his T7 and veteran coach.

I found this video interesting. Although the presenter uses two high speed dry grinders and both CBN and conventional grinding wheels, his thoughts could be applied to a Tormek and diamond and/or conventional grinding wheels.

He describes himself as an active hobbiest woodturner who does sell some bowls. For several years, he used his $120 eight inch dry grinder with the 80 and 120 grit supplied grinding wheels. He found this combination satisfactory for his needs. Then he upgraded to a one horsepower grinder with 80 and 600 grit CBN wheels. He basically had no complaints with the sharpening quality of his new thiusand dollar rig. It works as wel as his old one hundred twenty dollar rig. He did note that the old rig required a fifteen dollar diamond T truing and dressing tool.

His criticism of the new rig was that, for his essentially hobbiest use, he felt the much larger cost was overkill. In fairness, I must also state, that a set up with a couple diamond wheels could also be considered overkill for him.

There is nothing wrong with a fancy CBN or diamond rig, although for many years we made do with an SG-250 at most more modest cost. Since almost sharpening is restoring the existing bevel, the old combination still works for thrifty sharpeners. Here is a link:

https://youtu.be/4V1r1oFJa8c?si=zehFcYDltDbJs92y

Ken

This situation is not unique to Tormek. Back when my 2013 Equinox was still under warranty, I would have been very surprised if GM would have honored a warranty request if I had modified the engine with non GM components, even if they made the car run better.

Most of you were not here during the early days of CBN usage. Wootz (Vadim) was the first forum member to use CBN wheels. This predated the diamond wheels by several years.

CBN wheels were designed for high speed dry grinding of hss turning tools. Adapting them to Tormek use was a later after thought. I do not believe the vendors before Wootz even owned a Tormek. The sharpening videos they posted all used high speed dry grinders, generally run at full speed. This is not a criticism of CBN wheels. They perform this high speed function very well. They also happen to work well with the Tormek, although this was an after thought. One vendor clearly stated that using them wet would void the warranty. In my opinion, this was because of warranty claims due to carelessly leaving the wheels soaking rather than in product defects.


i have seen enough supporting evidence to believe that mounting a second grinding wheel on a Tormek may well work. I have even seen photos of these second wheels working with an added water trough, the way Tormek wheels should be used. However, one should be aware that using any product, including a Tormek, in a way not endorsed by the manufacturer may void the warranty. The safe and most versatile  play is just to purchase a T8 custom as a second machine.

Ken

John,



I would consider your solution both possible and practical. Clever!

Ken

Thanks, I will keepthatin mind.
Ken

I think if I ever need to sharpen a ceramic knife, I will stick with the DF wheel.

Ken

ERROR:

I inadvertently used "KS-123" instead of "KJ-45". Mea culpa.

Ken

PS to CB: No, I have not convexed that knife yet. I hadhoped that whatever this malady is that has been effecting my balance would have cleared up before this. As of now, it does seem to be very gradually clearing up.

Phil,

Please keep in mind the importance of the fifty year warranty with your T8 Black Edition.

I would lean toward the versatility and warranty safety of just purchasing a second stripped down T8 Custom. That would let you use both a second grinding wheel and both the composite and leather honing wheels.

Ken