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#1
General Tormek Questions / Re: Newbie here....
Last post by guitar_edg - Today at 01:56:04 AMHi All,
Time for some humor. I got my T-8 put together, and based on advice from this forum, I set to work on a cheap chisel. I was having a weird problem, in that I could not get the angle I wanted, without the jig knobs digging into the stone. Because.... I had the jig upside down. Once, I corrected that, I was able to work on a cheap chisel that I have on hand.
Now this chisel, I've had for a while, and I have tried to sharpen it with hand tools. It screwed it up so badly that after 30 minutes on the 220 grit stone, and I still don't have a flat surface on the face of the chisel.
Back at it I go.
Time for some humor. I got my T-8 put together, and based on advice from this forum, I set to work on a cheap chisel. I was having a weird problem, in that I could not get the angle I wanted, without the jig knobs digging into the stone. Because.... I had the jig upside down. Once, I corrected that, I was able to work on a cheap chisel that I have on hand.
Now this chisel, I've had for a while, and I have tried to sharpen it with hand tools. It screwed it up so badly that after 30 minutes on the 220 grit stone, and I still don't have a flat surface on the face of the chisel.
Back at it I go.
#2
Knife Sharpening / Re: Retrofit for the KJ-45 to ...
Last post by VijayDoshi - Yesterday at 09:33:28 PMUpdate: We've been using the retrofit for a couple of weeks now. We no longer need to adjust the height of the USB because we have the additional span of the shaft. We haven't found any issue yet with having a longer shaft other than it makes our work easier. The standard threads are tighter than the acme threads on the original and the fit is a bit looser. This makes for fast adjustment against the wood block we use to align. My employees are very happy since this speeds up their work and they are commission based per-inch. We did a farmer's market and never had to change our USB height the whole day! We sharpened over 100 knives.
In any case, we are pleased. One improvement in the next production run will be to add 5-10 mm of threads at the lower limit to account for even wider knives and perhaps chamfer the end of the adjustment knob more for comfort. The all aluminum construction also seems to be self-lubricating against the USB, only concern there is wear...
In any case, we are pleased. One improvement in the next production run will be to add 5-10 mm of threads at the lower limit to account for even wider knives and perhaps chamfer the end of the adjustment knob more for comfort. The all aluminum construction also seems to be self-lubricating against the USB, only concern there is wear...
#3
Knife Sharpening / Re: thoughts on SVM and KJ kni...
Last post by VijayDoshi - Yesterday at 07:37:04 AMHi folks,
I've developed a retrofit for the KJ-45 to make it more like the SVM. If you, like me are frustrated with the KJs, take a look! I also made the shaft longer and used a standard vs ACME thread.
https://magnoliaknife.com/products/tormek-kj-45-adjustable-retrofit
I've developed a retrofit for the KJ-45 to make it more like the SVM. If you, like me are frustrated with the KJs, take a look! I also made the shaft longer and used a standard vs ACME thread.
https://magnoliaknife.com/products/tormek-kj-45-adjustable-retrofit
#4
General Tormek Questions / Re: Where should I order T-8 B...
Last post by TireguyfromMA - Yesterday at 01:29:46 AMI purchased my T8, a few extra wheels, just about every jig TORMEK makes, and a few other supplies from Sharpening Supplies over the past couple years and have always been very happy with the customer service there. My first T8 arrived with a cracked case, they had replacement on the way right away.
#5
Knife Sharpening / Re: How to achieve less than 1...
Last post by 3D Anvil - May 14, 2024, 08:06:24 PMI think it's quite possible to get a 15 dps edge to 100 BESS or lower using the SG wheel and leather wheel with PA-70.
Best to keep it simple. We know there are two components to sharpening:
1) Apex the edge. Can you feel a burr all long the edge after your final pass on one side, and then on the other side? If so, the SG wheel has done its job.
2) Remove the burr. This is the hard part when it comes to getting very low BESS scores. You can get sub-optimal results if you:
a. Don't remove all of the burr, which can happen if you are honing at too low an angle, or if you don't hone enough.
b. Round the apex by honing at too high of an angle, or apply too much pressure when honing.
Freehand honing on the leather wheel is definitely something that takes some practice and muscle memory to perfect. You can work around that by using a front vertical base to hone with a jig, or keep practicing!
I would suggest marking the edge before you start honing so you have a better idea where the bevel is hitting. It's also helpful to use some kind of magnification to give you a better idea what's happening.
Lastly, I think it helps to minimize the burr as much as possible before you go to the leather wheel. One way to do that is to do a couple very quick, very light alternating passes on the sharpening stone.
Wootz's method generally involved honing at higher angles before finishing at the sharpening angle, depending on the steel involved.
Best to keep it simple. We know there are two components to sharpening:
1) Apex the edge. Can you feel a burr all long the edge after your final pass on one side, and then on the other side? If so, the SG wheel has done its job.
2) Remove the burr. This is the hard part when it comes to getting very low BESS scores. You can get sub-optimal results if you:
a. Don't remove all of the burr, which can happen if you are honing at too low an angle, or if you don't hone enough.
b. Round the apex by honing at too high of an angle, or apply too much pressure when honing.
Freehand honing on the leather wheel is definitely something that takes some practice and muscle memory to perfect. You can work around that by using a front vertical base to hone with a jig, or keep practicing!
I would suggest marking the edge before you start honing so you have a better idea where the bevel is hitting. It's also helpful to use some kind of magnification to give you a better idea what's happening.
Lastly, I think it helps to minimize the burr as much as possible before you go to the leather wheel. One way to do that is to do a couple very quick, very light alternating passes on the sharpening stone.
Wootz's method generally involved honing at higher angles before finishing at the sharpening angle, depending on the steel involved.
#6
Knife Sharpening / Re: How to achieve less than 1...
Last post by Ken S - May 14, 2024, 03:46:20 AMNick,
You make some good points. Like you, I believe one of the most useful functions of BESS testing in detecting minute residual burr which needs to be removed. I've known Mike Brubacher, the "B" in BESS, for many years through email. Mike is a really nice, helpful guy.
I have thought about purchasing a PT50A because of its 1 gram accuracy. So far, I have tabled that decision. My early version of the PT50B with 5 gram accuracy is more than enough for me. In fact, the 25 gram accuracy of the PT50C will detect residual burr problems. (For a shapener thinking of buying a BESS tester, I recommend at least the B model.)
Ken
You make some good points. Like you, I believe one of the most useful functions of BESS testing in detecting minute residual burr which needs to be removed. I've known Mike Brubacher, the "B" in BESS, for many years through email. Mike is a really nice, helpful guy.
I have thought about purchasing a PT50A because of its 1 gram accuracy. So far, I have tabled that decision. My early version of the PT50B with 5 gram accuracy is more than enough for me. In fact, the 25 gram accuracy of the PT50C will detect residual burr problems. (For a shapener thinking of buying a BESS tester, I recommend at least the B model.)
Ken
#7
General Tormek Questions / Re: Newbie here....
Last post by guitar_edg - May 14, 2024, 03:46:04 AMI'm counting my chisels, planes, scissors, and kitchen knives that need to be sharpened.
I will be busy for a while.
My wife has some Cuisinart knives. I figure I can use them for practice without really hurting anything. Is there a possibility that I could actually sharpen them?
Take care,
edg
I will be busy for a while.
My wife has some Cuisinart knives. I figure I can use them for practice without really hurting anything. Is there a possibility that I could actually sharpen them?
Take care,
edg
#8
General Tormek Questions / Re: Newbie here....
Last post by John Hancock Sr - May 14, 2024, 12:57:08 AMQuote from: guitar_edg on May 13, 2024, 11:22:39 PMBDay on Wednesday, so I can't open it until then
Nice. If you are anything like me then the first few weeks you will be busy sharpening.
#9
General Tormek Questions / Re: Newbie here....
Last post by guitar_edg - May 13, 2024, 11:22:39 PMThey lied. It's here a day early. 
BDay on Wednesday, so I can't open it until then. So 2 days to watch the videos.
Take care,
edg
BDay on Wednesday, so I can't open it until then. So 2 days to watch the videos.
Take care,
edg
#10
Knife Sharpening / Re: How to achieve less than 1...
Last post by tgbto - May 13, 2024, 02:40:24 PMTo me there is a world between 150 BESS and 100 BESS, and another one (maybe two) between 100 BESS and 50 BESS. I have never gotten to 50 BESS, but the standard SG/PA-70-on-leather setup gives me consistently 90-110 BESS with 15 dps, and 85-100 BESS with 12.5 dps.
150 BESS happens in a few situations that I can think of :
- Knives made out of junk (soft) steel. They can't be sharpened at an acute angle and an obtuse angle yields poor results anyway.
- Partially honed knives. There is a burr or some plastified metal left, so they have to be honed some more.
- Medium quality steel finished with chromium oxide or diamond spray on felt wheel. I could never figure for the life of me why it would degrade BESS readings, but it does, probably because of poor technique. The readings get back to 100ish if I hone them again on the leather wheel. This phenomenon doesn't happen on 63+ HRC steel.
So I wouldn't loose courage if I were you, I would try to hone a bit more than you usually do, and remember Vadim's results that low initial BESS is not a significant factor in edge retention. Steel quality and edge angle are, though. I also find that SG edges tend to retain their cutting ability longer than SJ edges.
150 BESS happens in a few situations that I can think of :
- Knives made out of junk (soft) steel. They can't be sharpened at an acute angle and an obtuse angle yields poor results anyway.
- Partially honed knives. There is a burr or some plastified metal left, so they have to be honed some more.
- Medium quality steel finished with chromium oxide or diamond spray on felt wheel. I could never figure for the life of me why it would degrade BESS readings, but it does, probably because of poor technique. The readings get back to 100ish if I hone them again on the leather wheel. This phenomenon doesn't happen on 63+ HRC steel.
So I wouldn't loose courage if I were you, I would try to hone a bit more than you usually do, and remember Vadim's results that low initial BESS is not a significant factor in edge retention. Steel quality and edge angle are, though. I also find that SG edges tend to retain their cutting ability longer than SJ edges.