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#61
Tormek T-1 and T-2 / Re: Starting Knife Sharpening ...
Last post by Royale - October 27, 2024, 08:51:16 PMQuote from: keo on October 12, 2024, 03:15:17 AMHello. Looking to the community for thoughts and comments on using my T1 to start a small knife sharpening table at a local farmer's market. What would you charge per knife? Do you think it worth it. Goal is to keep it small. No interest in growing big. Thank you.
Copied directly from the Tormek T-1 user manual
"Automatic overheat protection
The Tormek T-1 has a recommended maximum operating time of 30 minutes per hour. The motor has an automatic overheat protection system that will shut off the motor if it reaches a certain temperature. Note: If the motor shuts off, always turn off the machine by pressing the power button as the motor will resume operation once it cools down."
I think a key consideration specific to the T-1 is the duration of knife sharpening you plan to conduct at the farmer's market in a workday. I don't personally own a T-1, but I got myself the T-8 largely because of the longer runtimes (on top of its versatility)
You may run into issues if you get a surge of customers and the T-1 keeps shutting down to cool off.
#62
Hand Tool Woodworking / sharpening a new bevel on a ha...
Last post by rob69 - October 26, 2024, 10:06:22 PMHello,
new on the forum and I have a question. My hand plane blades are sharpened at 25 degrees. In the workshop I give it a micro bevel of 30 degrees (by hand, not with the Tormek). After a while I need to put a new bevel on it (25 degrees). I do this with my Tormek T8 (normal stone).
A small Lee Nielson block plane blade took me more then 1,5 hours tonight. I tried everything; grinding the stone again (taking a bit of the stone with the jig), and making it coarse again and again with the grinding stone.
Really frustrating. So I could use some useful tips on this issue.
Thanks a lot in advance.
Rob
new on the forum and I have a question. My hand plane blades are sharpened at 25 degrees. In the workshop I give it a micro bevel of 30 degrees (by hand, not with the Tormek). After a while I need to put a new bevel on it (25 degrees). I do this with my Tormek T8 (normal stone).
A small Lee Nielson block plane blade took me more then 1,5 hours tonight. I tried everything; grinding the stone again (taking a bit of the stone with the jig), and making it coarse again and again with the grinding stone.
Really frustrating. So I could use some useful tips on this issue.
Thanks a lot in advance.
Rob
#63
General Tormek Questions / Re: SG Grindstone vs Diamond W...
Last post by John Hancock Sr - October 26, 2024, 05:38:14 AMI use the SG for regular knives, carbon steel chisels, plane blades, and axes. For HSS plane blades, planer blades, chisels, and Japanese knives I use the diamond wheels. The SB would also be fine but I bought the diamond wheels.
#64
General Tormek Questions / Re: SG Grindstone vs Diamond W...
Last post by tgbto - October 25, 2024, 05:08:00 PMAs far as I am concerned, I use the SB mainly for HSS drills.
The SB works a charm for those, and I prefer it to diamond wheels because I don't have to worry about pressure (which I have a harder time adjusting with the drill jig than with the knife jig).
It does tend to glaze a bit, but the "Wootz maneuver" with a coarse diamond stone quickly restores it to a duly aggressive surface. I have only trued it once and slightly so since I own it.
The SB works a charm for those, and I prefer it to diamond wheels because I don't have to worry about pressure (which I have a harder time adjusting with the drill jig than with the knife jig).
It does tend to glaze a bit, but the "Wootz maneuver" with a coarse diamond stone quickly restores it to a duly aggressive surface. I have only trued it once and slightly so since I own it.
#65
General Tormek Questions / Re: SG Grindstone vs Diamond W...
Last post by Ken S - October 25, 2024, 03:26:51 PMInteresting thoughts, Rich.
One thing which has puzzled me over the years is how little attention has been given to the SB and, to a lesser extent, to the SJ. This lack of attention predated the introduction of the diamond wheels. I remember when pioneers like our own Wootz and also Derek from Perth first wrote about the difficulties of using early CBN wheels. The problem was that the wheels dished and were no longer flat. This problem was not unique to CBN; all of our wheels became out of true with use. The difference was that wheels like the SG and SB could be retrued using the TT-50 truing tool. Admittedly, restoring the wheel to true reduced the diameter somewhat; however, the CBN alternative was a wheel which gradually became further out of true and could not be corrected.
Examining the handbook, I could only find one paragraph covering the SB. Even that one paragraph was shared with the SJ. As valuable as I find both the handbook and the online classes, I have never understood why the SB has been so ignored. The glamour wheel, the SJ, gets more attention in the classes, which puzzles me. The SJ adds the spit and polish shine to already sharp edges. The SB can do the really hard work of efficiently grinding heavier sharpening harder steels.
Years ago, we had posts about the SB. These were frequently complaints about the wheel glazing. In fairness, there were a very few real experts who had good results with the SB. These were few. Eventually the SB seemed to fall into oblivion.
The SB, like the SG, can supposedly be graded with the stone grader. I would like to read successful posts about this; I have never had much luck with the SB and stone grader. The online classes do a good job of demonstrating and explaining how to use the TT-50 and the stone grader; however, this is always done with the SG. If the SB truly is an easily gradable stone, I believe this versatile stone deserves more attention. Especially if gradable, I think it can fill the gap between the SG and diamond wheels and do so at much lower cost than either diamond or CBN wheels.
Ken
One thing which has puzzled me over the years is how little attention has been given to the SB and, to a lesser extent, to the SJ. This lack of attention predated the introduction of the diamond wheels. I remember when pioneers like our own Wootz and also Derek from Perth first wrote about the difficulties of using early CBN wheels. The problem was that the wheels dished and were no longer flat. This problem was not unique to CBN; all of our wheels became out of true with use. The difference was that wheels like the SG and SB could be retrued using the TT-50 truing tool. Admittedly, restoring the wheel to true reduced the diameter somewhat; however, the CBN alternative was a wheel which gradually became further out of true and could not be corrected.
Examining the handbook, I could only find one paragraph covering the SB. Even that one paragraph was shared with the SJ. As valuable as I find both the handbook and the online classes, I have never understood why the SB has been so ignored. The glamour wheel, the SJ, gets more attention in the classes, which puzzles me. The SJ adds the spit and polish shine to already sharp edges. The SB can do the really hard work of efficiently grinding heavier sharpening harder steels.
Years ago, we had posts about the SB. These were frequently complaints about the wheel glazing. In fairness, there were a very few real experts who had good results with the SB. These were few. Eventually the SB seemed to fall into oblivion.
The SB, like the SG, can supposedly be graded with the stone grader. I would like to read successful posts about this; I have never had much luck with the SB and stone grader. The online classes do a good job of demonstrating and explaining how to use the TT-50 and the stone grader; however, this is always done with the SG. If the SB truly is an easily gradable stone, I believe this versatile stone deserves more attention. Especially if gradable, I think it can fill the gap between the SG and diamond wheels and do so at much lower cost than either diamond or CBN wheels.
Ken
#66
General Tormek Questions / SG Grindstone vs Diamond Wheel...
Last post by RichColvin - October 24, 2024, 04:39:54 AMI've seen a number of posts regarding the question:
From my experiences with all 6 grinding wheels (SG, SB, SJ, DC, DF, & DE), I have come to believe that a better question is
I find that I use the diamond grinding wheels for harder metals like
These were previously sharpened using the SB grindstone.
And, I use the SG grindstone for almost everything else.
So the question to be answered is,
If the tools to be sharpened are harder steels, then go with either the diamond grinding wheels or the SB grindstone. Do note that the SB grindstone can be regraded, so I believe it is comparable to the DF + DE grinding wheels. And the SB is lower cost than the two diamond wheels.
If you are not needing to sharpen tools with such hardness, go with the SG grindstone.
If you need both, my advice is to start with the SG & SB grindstones. Eventually, the SB grindstone will wear down and need to be replaced. Then you can consider getting the diamond grinding wheels.
I welcome thoughts and feedback on experiences from others.
Should one invest in diamond grinding wheels or go with the SG grindstone?
From my experiences with all 6 grinding wheels (SG, SB, SJ, DC, DF, & DE), I have come to believe that a better question is
Should one invest in diamond grinding wheels or go with the SB grindstone?
I find that I use the diamond grinding wheels for harder metals like
- Wood turning tools (usually HSS)
- Carbide inserts for wood and metal lathe tools
- Drill bits
These were previously sharpened using the SB grindstone.
And, I use the SG grindstone for almost everything else.
So the question to be answered is,
What do you plan to sharpen?
If the tools to be sharpened are harder steels, then go with either the diamond grinding wheels or the SB grindstone. Do note that the SB grindstone can be regraded, so I believe it is comparable to the DF + DE grinding wheels. And the SB is lower cost than the two diamond wheels.
If you are not needing to sharpen tools with such hardness, go with the SG grindstone.
If you need both, my advice is to start with the SG & SB grindstones. Eventually, the SB grindstone will wear down and need to be replaced. Then you can consider getting the diamond grinding wheels.
I welcome thoughts and feedback on experiences from others.
#67
General Tormek Questions / Re: Tormek Tips Tricks and Tec...
Last post by tgbto - October 23, 2024, 10:29:26 AMHello Philip,
In terms of tools, I would advise the following :
- A KJ-45 knife jig
- A KS-123 angle setter, as you mention, so wheel diameter will not be an issue
- A USB-420 long support bar. It is not only useful for long knives, but also for medium knives where you want some leeway in terms of clamping position in the jig
- A MB-102 that will allow you to control the angle easily when honing (or grinding edge trailing, more on that further down)
- If you want to refine the edge, or make it coarser, two (non Tormek) diamond plates for grading the SG wheel coarse or fine, they will help grade the stone faster, while staying true longer than when using the SP-650. You will use the SE-77 tool that comes with the Tormek for this. The longer the plates the better.
Regarding heel to tip or tip to heel, definitely heel to tip. You need control when dealing with the tip and you will notice quickly that control is harder to get when you're just laying the knife down on the stone. As for the change of angle at the tip, there is no short answer : if you care about looks, you'll probably let the contact point ride up the wheel on most knives, if you want a consistent angle you will rotate the jig so the tip stays in the same place. Practice (and a sharpie) will help you chose your course of action for every knife. You won't get "six sigma", hardware-constrained repeatability for this.
Now regarding the diamond stone, I have two of them and never use them for knives. I don't like the feedback compared to the SG wheel, the scratch pattern is not as even, and they require more fussing around than the Sg stone (they are more fragile, and ACC Anticorrosion concentrate is almost mandatory). Diamond stones shine in my opinion for carbide tools or very hard steels, or when a flat grind is mandatory.
If by stropping you mean stropping on a separate leather strop after honing, it will most probably increase sharpness (if done properly) for the first few hours or the first few strokes. Only you can tell if that is important to you, I personally aim for edge retention rather than initial sharpness. And my experience is that an ungraded SG-250 followed by careful honing are the best time/performance compromise.
In terms of tools, I would advise the following :
- A KJ-45 knife jig
- A KS-123 angle setter, as you mention, so wheel diameter will not be an issue
- A USB-420 long support bar. It is not only useful for long knives, but also for medium knives where you want some leeway in terms of clamping position in the jig
- A MB-102 that will allow you to control the angle easily when honing (or grinding edge trailing, more on that further down)
- If you want to refine the edge, or make it coarser, two (non Tormek) diamond plates for grading the SG wheel coarse or fine, they will help grade the stone faster, while staying true longer than when using the SP-650. You will use the SE-77 tool that comes with the Tormek for this. The longer the plates the better.
Regarding heel to tip or tip to heel, definitely heel to tip. You need control when dealing with the tip and you will notice quickly that control is harder to get when you're just laying the knife down on the stone. As for the change of angle at the tip, there is no short answer : if you care about looks, you'll probably let the contact point ride up the wheel on most knives, if you want a consistent angle you will rotate the jig so the tip stays in the same place. Practice (and a sharpie) will help you chose your course of action for every knife. You won't get "six sigma", hardware-constrained repeatability for this.
Now regarding the diamond stone, I have two of them and never use them for knives. I don't like the feedback compared to the SG wheel, the scratch pattern is not as even, and they require more fussing around than the Sg stone (they are more fragile, and ACC Anticorrosion concentrate is almost mandatory). Diamond stones shine in my opinion for carbide tools or very hard steels, or when a flat grind is mandatory.
If by stropping you mean stropping on a separate leather strop after honing, it will most probably increase sharpness (if done properly) for the first few hours or the first few strokes. Only you can tell if that is important to you, I personally aim for edge retention rather than initial sharpness. And my experience is that an ungraded SG-250 followed by careful honing are the best time/performance compromise.
#68
General Tormek Questions / Re: Tormek Tips Tricks and Tec...
Last post by Ken S - October 23, 2024, 07:17:49 AMWelcome to the forum, Philip. No, you have not worn out your welcome. 
Please keep in mind that these thoughts are my opinion. Others on the forum probably have equally valid other opinions. I would start with just the SG-250 grinding wheel. It comes with the T8 Original, as does the TT-50 truing tool and stone grader. The SG-250 has been serving Tormek knife sharpeners well for decades. Using the stone grader, it is not necessary to purchase multiple grinding wheels. I am not familiar with Six Sigma; however, with kitchen knives, the grinding wheel wears very slowly. Once you become proficient, wheel wear, truing and dressing is not a big deal. (In my opinion, things like wheel wear, truing and dressing only became magnified when vendors, including Tormek, started selling other wheels.)
I suggest you start by learning the traditional three step Tormek technique as demonstrated in the online classes. Eventually, you may want to try incorporating other ideas into your technique. Wait until your basic technique is solid.
Keep us posted.
Ken
PS You will get more replies by posting in the knife sharpening sub forum.
Please keep in mind that these thoughts are my opinion. Others on the forum probably have equally valid other opinions. I would start with just the SG-250 grinding wheel. It comes with the T8 Original, as does the TT-50 truing tool and stone grader. The SG-250 has been serving Tormek knife sharpeners well for decades. Using the stone grader, it is not necessary to purchase multiple grinding wheels. I am not familiar with Six Sigma; however, with kitchen knives, the grinding wheel wears very slowly. Once you become proficient, wheel wear, truing and dressing is not a big deal. (In my opinion, things like wheel wear, truing and dressing only became magnified when vendors, including Tormek, started selling other wheels.)
I suggest you start by learning the traditional three step Tormek technique as demonstrated in the online classes. Eventually, you may want to try incorporating other ideas into your technique. Wait until your basic technique is solid.
Keep us posted.
Ken
PS You will get more replies by posting in the knife sharpening sub forum.
#69
General Tormek Questions / Beginner - what to buy?
Last post by PJHAGEMAN - October 22, 2024, 05:21:59 PMThinking of buying the T8 bundle and K-123. Have watched numerous videos and wonder:
1) Is there point in getting diamond stone(s)? One thing important to me: repeatability. From my Lean Six Sigma background, I should eliminate variability to the extent possible. A diamond wheel would not wear away like a stone wheel.
2) How often do you have to dress a stone wheel?
3) Is an attachment necessary to accurately dress a stone wheel?
4) Knives are my primary interest - all sorts: Nakiri, Santoku, German makes, filet, to name a few; what wheels and attachments would be best to have on hand?
6) Tip-to-heel, or heal to tip: videos show both techniques. Which/when? Follow on: if set up for 15 degree, the tip is not 15 degree because blade contact with the stone moves diametrically toward the vertical (90 degrees). Is this a practical issue of concern?
5) What about stropping?
6) I want the sharpest, consistant practical edge for all knives.
Have I worn out my welcome?
1) Is there point in getting diamond stone(s)? One thing important to me: repeatability. From my Lean Six Sigma background, I should eliminate variability to the extent possible. A diamond wheel would not wear away like a stone wheel.
2) How often do you have to dress a stone wheel?
3) Is an attachment necessary to accurately dress a stone wheel?
4) Knives are my primary interest - all sorts: Nakiri, Santoku, German makes, filet, to name a few; what wheels and attachments would be best to have on hand?
6) Tip-to-heel, or heal to tip: videos show both techniques. Which/when? Follow on: if set up for 15 degree, the tip is not 15 degree because blade contact with the stone moves diametrically toward the vertical (90 degrees). Is this a practical issue of concern?
5) What about stropping?
6) I want the sharpest, consistant practical edge for all knives.
Have I worn out my welcome?
#70
Hand Tool Woodworking / Re: an excellent demonstration...
Last post by Ken S - October 21, 2024, 06:55:34 PMMike,
How fortunate that you had the opportunity of studying with David Charesworth. I know that he preferred to use the Tormek only for grinding the primary bevel. I'm sure he had good reasons for this preference; I just wish I knew his reasoning.
Ken
How fortunate that you had the opportunity of studying with David Charesworth. I know that he preferred to use the Tormek only for grinding the primary bevel. I'm sure he had good reasons for this preference; I just wish I knew his reasoning.
Ken