Messages

Kess,
Be aware that the stone will stay wet for some time (as Ken says) so you need to make sure that the temperature in your shed will remain above freezing!! Not sure if it is heated or not but the tone may crack if the temperature gets too low.
Danny

Well, that was easy...

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Well done! A great simple idea that works well and pretty cheap too. One of those 'Why didn't anyone think ot this previously' ideas   
Danny

Well, in that case the Shleifjunkies FVB is a good option.

Unless.... you also have a diamond wheel in which case the new Tormek MB-102 may be more useful and possibly cheaper.

Danny

If you are catching on the the second stop on the jig (number 1) then you can only buy (or make) a FVB or remove the second stop on the KJ-45 jig but this is probably not a good idea. You may want to to use it one day!
Yes the FVB from schleifjunkies looks good. I bought another item from them and the service was very good.
Out if interest, here is a photo of my homemade FVB

on the machine

with support inserted

use with knife


There is something nice about making your own but to be honest I didn't really save money doing mine, I just enjoy making things.

There is also a swedish made version available but I can't find the link at the moment.
If I were to buy one now then the new Tormek MB-102 may well be cheaper. I have just seen one online for preorder in the UK for £90.https://www.yandles.co.uk/tormek-mb-102-multi-base/p30279

I imagine it will be for sale about 80 euros from Marcin in Belgium sometime soon.

Danny

Which is the part of the jig that is catching in the support bar? 1 or 2?



this has been a problem described here quite a few times previously. The solution that most people choose to get round this is to use a Front Vertical Base (FVB) or if it is the locking screw (number 2 in the photo) causing the problem you can chnage this for a small grub screw with Allen head  - M6 I believe.
The FVB is available from a few places. Here for example
FVB from Germany others are available.

The new Tormek jig MB-102 should also help as it can be used as a simple FVB.
See this recent thread
New MB-102 jig
I have yet to see this new jig for sale in the EU but it should be available soon.
Marcin in Belgium has very good prices

Danny

well, if that is really the price, it is really more or less the same as the MB100 jig...

I have been looking at purchasing 2 MB-100's to get FVB, but now 1 MB-102 will do it. I feel a Christmas present is in my future.

I'm still waiting to see any prices for the new jig but if you only want an FVB and have no diamond wheels like me (i.e. no need to grind on side of wheel) then I imagine it will be cheaper just to get an FVB from Shleifjunkies or one of the other makers.
Of course, if one has diamond wheels this jig could be pretty useful. Let's see what the cost is...
Danny

Did you buy this SE-77 new? if so, it is missing one tightening knob and will not work correctly without it....
Danny

I also notice in the Tormek promotional video entitled 'Tormek T-4 sharpening system: Getting Started with Alan Holtham' (youtube) that @ 1.09 mins the grinding stone is rotating in a clockwise direction but @ 3:26 mins the rotation is anti-clockwise??

This is not the case if you look carefully. At 3m29s, the view is from behind the machine. See where the water trough is in relation to the wheel.

All tormek machines only rotate in one direction.
Danny

Hello,
it appears that the jig is correct but it is just missing one tightening knob.

You have set the chisel at the wrong side of the jig. The arrow shows you where the chisel is supposed to go. The end is square for the side of the chisel or plane blade.
See this picture as an example

Here is the PDF version of the instructions from Tormek on how to use the jig, if you have not read them already.
SE-77 Instructions
I am not sure why you think it is a problem to grind toward the chisel bevel?? It is intended to grind in this direction. Again see manual or various videos if you prefer.
Like this
SE-77 quick video
or this see the first minute of this video
or this older one which shows the older SE-76 jig but the main idea is exactly the same. SE-76 video

Of course, if you really want to grind away from the bevel then nothing is stopping you from using the horizontal support instead and just setting the chisel in the opposite way.. i will try to do a photo. See if this shows OK


hope that helps,
Danny

[the problem is that you true any wheel and the next time you mount it it wobbles.]

So because it has been asked here what the problems are with changing wheels: the problem is that you true any wheel and the next time you mount it it wobbles.
I find myself re-opening and re-fastening the wheels several times before it runs acceptable, but never as true as before.

This is another reason I prefer not to remove the wheel even though not many users who do change wheels frequently report having any problem with this.

The SG-200 (I have a T3), unlike the after-market other wheels I have, has a few tenth of a millimeter bore play and I have to put on thin layers of adhesive tape every time I mount it. And of course remove this once I use a different wheel.
This is really sickening.

If anybody has found a fix for this, I would be very thankful.

This does sound like a particular problem with either the wheel hole or the axle on your machine. More generally, some people suggest always lining up the wheel with the label writing horizontally before tightening so that it goes back in theory in the same place. Not sure it would help if there is significant play between the parts. I think I read of someone using some sort of epoxy filler on the wheel hole with a suitable diameter teflon? rod while it sets. This may not be possible with such a small amount of play though.

Danny

Hi Dan. Ken is giving good advice. When I am doing a batch of knives I put them all at the same projection on my jigs for a given angle set up on grinding wheel on the T8. Set all those knives ready for honing. Then remove grind wheel and set up for honing on leather wheel with a FVB. Or your chosen honing method. The removal of the grinding wheel becomes less of an issue.
You will need more jigs though. I have 10 of the old svm45 which makes it easy for volume sharpening and with those old adjustable jigs makes it easy to set them all to a predetermined projection measurement.
If you are just occasional sharpening, what is the issue with removing the grinding wheel to enable you to hone?
Am I missing something with your problem?
You already seem to have solved the problem with your independent honing set up.

Not sure I see it as a 'problem' per se... I simply don't want to remove the wheel each time I want to hone a knife accurately.
It involves (unless I am not getting something  )
setting up angle,
grinding knife,
lowering water tray,
emptying water tray,
removing grinding wheel,
do honing,
remounting grinding wheel,
putting water tray back on and up,
refilling water level in tray,
resetting angle,
and all over again for each knife. This assumes that the grinding wheel goes back on exactly lined up and true as before which I have doubts about.

Or buy 10 knife jigs like you say    but then one still has to mount each knife in a jig anyway so no real time saving in that sense.

I just wanted a different way.
 
As I said, it is much more straightforward in my mind to grind, then keeping the knife in the jig so no change of projection distance (I have only one KJ-45) and go straight to honing on the other wheel I got. The grinding wheel is still ready and waiting for the next knife.
Each knife takes a few minutes to sharpen (grind and hone) accurately with no faffing around.

To me it is more or less an extension of the whole Tormek idea. The machine is a grinding wheel and honing wheel already set up on one machine. This is perfect for woodworking tools and some others and is a hassle free design. No need to change wheels on and off for honing etc. Just imagine if there was only one axle with a wheel available. You would need to change the wheel to hone and then once again to grind.
To me that is the situation with knives. The Tormek is simply not really designed for knives which is probably why a lot of people who do knives regularly develop a separate system for honing.
The T8 and T4 are excellent machines but they have some limits.
It reminds me of that machine that Tormek made in the past (see history of Tormek video) with a long axle and hence a big distance between the grinding and honing wheels. They obviously decided not to pursue this design as it made it a big and bulky item. But it looked very practical for longer items like knives.

For most people the basic machine is OK and you find ways to use it satisfactorily. My separate honing wheel thing didn't cost a lot and works very well for longer items.

I hope that helps explains my thinking somewhat.

Danny

--

...batch of ten knives, are all ten of them long enough to require removing the grinding wheel?

If using the USB to hone then, yes, definitely. For manual honing of couse it is OK at an angle to avoid the grinding wheel but it is just not so accurate (for me anyway) even with a lot of practice.

...If the removal/replacement time is a real problem, extra knife jigs are less expensive than a second machine. Two or three spare knife jigs would certainly speed things.

Ken

Not sure how extra jigs might speed it up as you still have to mount each knife in a jig regardless. Anyway as I said, I had the other very cheap machine anyway to use. Maybe if one gets a good price on a used T4 or even T3, it would make an affordable useful honing place.
Now, for me with this set up, it is very easy to grind knives and then quickly transfer to the other machine for honing without any changing of wheels and still keeping the knife in the jig to allow for angle accuracy.

Danny

  Thanks for your answers.

I am extremely happy with my T8 but there are limitations. The basic set up works extremely well for woodworking tools but achieving the same results with knives (and especially larger ones) is more complicated without some sort of adaptation.
Removing the grinding wheel to hone is just a pain to me.
On the T8 I couldn't find a satisfactory method for honing knives with the grinding wheel on. I asked the question about your technique in the hope that I had missed something   

I decided to use the slow drive on the bench grinder as I never used it for grinding at all. It was just there anyway. I did have to upgrade the machine little to run nicely but it wasn't too difficult. These machines are really not bad but quite poorly made in terms of accuracy.

Still, with a little effort I can now grind and hone quite precisely. I still use the Tormek honing wheel for chisels and planes.

As far as the FVB is concerned, I made one myself which I am very happy with. I must say that I have not had extensive use of it yet. I haven't really found  much need apart from sharpening a very wide cleaver which was difficult to grind on the usual side as the USB was hardly in the slots! I know I could get a longer Tormek USB to help but....
The FVB enables the USB to change its position dramatically - just pull out a bit and the USB is much further away. This allows the same angles for wider blades but much lower in the vertical slots to get a solid position. This means grinding away from you for a change but it works very well too.

Danny