Messages

[us]

From your pdf...

SVM-jigs is unfortunately not possible without further ado.
The KS-123 is clamped onto the Universal Support Bar (USB) while setting
the sharpening angle. When using the adjustable knife jigs, the adjustable
stop will rest against that clamp and is therefore at a distance Ko from the
USB.

Why are you resting the stop against the clamp and not the USB (like you do when using the KJ jig?)

Also, your reference 2 link doesn't work in the U.S.  (Need to change the nl to us)...

https://apps.apple.com/us/app/basic-programming-language/id1540244170

Hello,
Very interesting.
Can I ask how it compares to (or how it differs from) Calcapp which I use?

For info, I do not have an iphone but use Calcapp on android which I find extremely useful and well thought out for knife sharpening and also chisel/plane sharpening.
One more question if you don't mind...
Why do you have a choice of grinding wheel setting as well as the current diameter setting? Not sure I understand??

Danny

The main difference is that Calcapp sets the bar height measuring directly to the wheel, this app sets the bar height measuring to the top of the machine.  But as far as accuracy, the "math behind the scene", etc. there's no difference.

Edit:  I should have added that measuring to the top of the machine requires knowing or obtaining some measurements of the machine setup itself (usually referred to as the horizontal and vertical measurements).  Measuring directly to the wheel doesn't require this.

BTW, Thank you for the "review"... glad you like it. 

OK thanks for the reply.
As I understand it, Calcapp is usable on all platforms as it is web browser based.

https://knifesharpeningcalculators.wordpress.com/

Danny

You are correct! 

Usually use 50 and 29 (for a T-8)

You cannot view this attachment.

What software do people use for angle setting on a T-8?

I stopped using a T-8  about 5 years ago. At the time I had KnifeGrinders software.

It no longer loads on my i-phone and the app is no longer available in App Store.

Any thoughts?

I primarily sharpen kitchen knives

Thanks

Try this one...

https://connect.calcapp.net/?app=dsa8z4

... it's similar to the KG apps you're used to.

(Or check the links in my signature.)

Hello, I started using the program. Many thanks to its author. A question arose. What are the numbers (Variable length HF - Frontal vertical base [mm]
Constant VF - Frontal vertical base [mm])
must be installed when using Tormek MB-102 as an FVB?

Thanks for the reply.The MB-102 can also have a fixed position that can be used as a base. For example, by pressing the bottom of the USB into the case.
...

I have a Calcapp calculator available using the MB-102...

https://connect.calcapp.net/?app=avoit9

... using the same idea.  I used a HD (HF) of 105mm for the T-4 133mm for the T-8 and VD (VF) of 38mm for the T-4 and 50mm for the T-8.  I measure to the top of the MB-102 to set the USB height.  (If you look in the Calcapp app there's some instructions a few 'pages' in on how I use it.)

Let me know if the measurements work for you in TormekCalc.

Hello,

Recently I picked up an SJ-250 on sale.  When I first purchased it (new), it required truing and to be put into round.  About a week ago I pulled it off my storage rack (12mm peg), mounted it and it was out of round again.  Used the truing tool once again and got it perfectly round.  Mounted it this morning and was not surprised that it was out of round again.

Is gravity to blame here?

Thanks.

After some digging about, I was told that some users determined that the mounting hole is off-centre on some of the Japanese wheels which would probably explain the issue I'm having.

I'll return it to the store.

Be curious where you read that some wheels come off center.  Part of the issue is they can't put a bushing in the SJ stone.  This tip might help...

A tip is when you mount the SJ wheel, always mount it so the label of the stone always shows "SJ-250" in level. The first time you might need to true it, but after that, it should be ok. Tighten the Ezy-lock harder by holding the honing wheel with your left hand and pull the stone towards you before you start the machine, tighten the Ezy-lock first,  this also straightens the stone a little.

SJ Wheel wheels rant

US-430 is fine, but what about an US-900? With this bad boy Tormek can be used even as a sword sharpening machine

Or...

This video is about a knife sharpening master class using a Tormek with two Morakniv experts. It is definitely must see. If you prefer, itis also available in three shorter videos on the same channel.

https://youtu.be/iYsgxerFKHk?si=SQPi6eII9y80V_cy

Ken

4:58.... is that... Dutchman?     

I truly would thank you all for taking the time to offer me some input.

I've gathered some insight with each of your responses.

One further question when you feel that the leather wheel is somewhat bulky in areas as it's spinning against the blades edge.
*How do you go about cleaning that area?

I mean, I could use the backside of my knife with slight pressure to somehow smooth out where the compound has become somewhat bulky and apply another spread out even coat again.

Truly, I like to thank you all for sharing your experience here.

Thank you Phil

It sounds to me like you may be using too much compound?  I can't recall ever having a noticeable buildup (or reading about one) like you described.

Clean it like you described (using the back of a knife as a "scraper)" and maybe try a little less.

I would also caution against using too much oil... it can reduce the effectiveness of the honing compound.

I guess I was lucky in that I never went down the "using the adjustable stop" path to set the angle.  I always made the adjustment using the Micro Adjust.  So adapting to the KJ-45 from that aspect wasn't an issue.

I made a "simplified version" of jvh's "BatchCalc", in Calcapp (I called it "Quick Adjust Calc").  It allows me to use the MicroAdjust to quickly adjust between knives, adjusting for Projection Distance and/or Angle changes, without using a measuring device each time.

While I think it's good to be aware that the USB can "hang" when being lowered, I don't feel the need to base my sharpening on this.  BTW, it's also recommended in the instructions to set the angle with the KS-123 only by raising the USB height.  (I don't know if any of this has anything to do with "play in the support bar" that's been talked about).

You cannot view this attachment.

When I feel the "need for speed" I use the "Quick Adjust" calculator, and then I hone freehand, which is not only faster, but I can angle the knife if needed, and avoid removing the sharpening wheel.  (Or use an alternate method than the leather/composite wheel to debur.)

Not saying any of the above posts are wrong, just giving a perspective from someone who never used the adjustable stop collar.

...
What are the telltale signs that more compound may be needed to the leather

I'm also finding a difficult to do controlled honing with the same USB height measurements while using the MB-102. Naturally, because the leather wheels diameter is smaller than the 250 diamond. Is the only way to fine-tune this measurement by utilizing of the computer Knife Sharpening applications to determine usb height while control honing?

I've actually been doing it freehand and it does seem by the sounds the leather makes when in contact with the knife edge, that it sounds like I'm at the right angle. ...
...

I don't think there's any real "signs" when to add compound, other than when it stops working.  You could try going longer between applications, and get an idea of when it stops.  It also depends on your desired results... I use the leather wheel strictly for burr removal, and not for polish, so I get away with adding more less often.

There are a few ways to match the honing angle... you can use a calculator app, use the KS-123, or mark the edge with a Sharpie and look where it's removed, are a few.

You're also on the right track of listening for the sound change when you reach the edge.

I would classify using the SVM-00 as a useful workaround.
...

Maybe that's what the "00" stands for.   

Apologies in advance for going over old ground but I think worth revisiting.
The introduction of the KS123 has highlighted the old topic of the slight movement of the USB when locking it in place with the nuts on the sleeve housing. Not talking backlash here. Neither am I referring to the need to push down on the USB above the micro adjust when locking to minimise movement. That movement is still there and it's no longer a suspicion as you can see the pointer move on the scale of the KS123 if you check after locking down.
Does this matter?
I think it does.
There are issues with accuracy and consistency with this.
Some will say not enough to affect things overly much but if I'm going to hone a knife at +1.5 degrees from the original grinding angle to remove a bur and then at exact to clean up, a discrepancy of +/- half a degree ( sometimes more) is going to matter. To me anyway.
So any thoughts on this?
Any work arounds?
As a slight aside. I think the movement caused by locking (as the end of the screw engages with the leg of the USB in the sleeve) is not so much up and down as side to side? Hence it's the projection distance being affected rather than the height of the USB. If that makes sense.
Right. That's my Sunday morning issue put out there. I'm back to the workshop to dream of a perfect world........

I spent some time this a.m. trying to get the angle to change looking at the KS-123, based on USB movement, and could barely get the needle to move.  So, I'm not sure how you're seeing it move that much when locking it down?

So, I then measured to the wheel using a digital angle gauge (this should also account for any Projection Distance change), and could detect around a .25mm change... that equals around less than .2 deg.  I don't know how you're getting as much difference ("a discrepancy of +/- half a degree ( sometimes more)") that you're seeing. 

Setting that aside, the need to hone at "decimal point" accuracy simply is not needed.  If based on KnifeGrinder's work, his "study" went thru a couple of iterations of his software that gave different answers (sometimes several degrees).  And the original version wasn't designed to work across several setups (like from Tormek to a grinder with paper wheels) so, when compared to the updated version, the answers again would vary.  (The "updated" KG software also has errors.) Plus, wouldn't this work be subject to the same USB movement?  The reality is most of the honing was just done at a higher angle than sharpened at, sometimes a lot more than stated.

So, the short answer, without more input on this, put me in the "doesn't matter" category.  I don't think you can be that accurate, nor does it matter.

I want to make sure I am understanding the use of the KS-123.

The angle measured is the per side angle?  And as such you can't use it if you want to put an angle of less than 16 degrees on a knife.

Aus Sn, do you actually sharpen knives with these bevel angles? If so, then a workaround is needed and is not a difficult problem. If not, then the question is theoretical. What kind of problem do we have?

Ken

There could be other reasons, for example, you can also use a lower angle as an alternative to thinning a blade, then put a final edge on at a higher angle.

I would think that the knife jig would hit the stone at under 8° per side, but then I've never tried it.

Depends on the height of the knife.  You can also achieve lower angles on some knives using the SVM-00.