tech support? a question for the moderator or tormek

[Rob]

Like I said....customers aren't stupid!

[Ken S]

Rob and I have mentioned the "T-N-T" video (touch and turn) Jeff Farris did for Tormek.  I don't like to write about something unless it is fresh on my mind.  I rewatched the video earlier this evening. It won't reach as large an audience as a free you tube.  However, in my opinion, the quality and amount of information well presented more than offset the cost. 

While the DVD is primarily oriented toward turning tools, it goes into the fundamentals in good detail.  Jeff demonstrates the use of the stone grader numerous times.  The importance of aligning the universal support bar in emphasized. The use of the diamond wheel dresser is demonstrated. The use of the leather honing wheel as well as the importance of it is demonstrated several times.

I consider this DVD an important part of a Tormek user's personal library even if no turning tools are sharpened.  I bought it before I purchased any turning jigs.  It could serve as a standard for further training videos. it cleverly combines sharpening discussions for the individual sharpening tools.  Than, if the viewer wishes and clicks "enter" on either thee keyboard or remote, the viewer is directed to a demonstration on using the particular tool.  Well done!   

Robin made some good points about the lack of a Tormek presence at the major annual wood show in Scotland.  I attended a more local show in Hartville, Ohio. I was hoping to talk with the Tormek rep.  The Tormek rep was a no show. I ended up purchasing a sharpening product from a competitor. 

Tormek makes a quality product. It is well designed, solidly built and versatile. Just in the few years I have been a Tormek user, the Tormek has become much more versatile.  I look forward to future innovations. However, the Tormek will not sell itself. Part of the marketing equation must be more than adequate training resources and satisfied, skilled users who will spread the word.

Ken

[Stickan]

Hi again,
As I wrote earlier, we attend as many shows and demo´s as possible but we cant be everywhere.
In the states the IWF is coming up in Atlanta, we will be there with our US agent. In Sweden I have a demo calender on the Swedish website and I could also have one on the English website.

Stig

Ken S : Here you have the video http://www.tormek.com/en/about/index.php

[Rob]

The dot connecting piece in this puzzle that has always made me confused about Tormek marketing strategy is the issue of YouTube.  Its such a blindingly obvious missed opportunity with staggeringly huge operations investment savings to be leveraged.

The ABSOLUTELY FANTASTIC  thing about the web is its ability to connect people across great distances.  That includes husbands and wives, children and grand children, buyers and sellers in auctions and of course manufacturers or retailers and their prospective customers.  Never before in the history of the human race has any medium even come close to the connecting power of the Internet.  Add to that the modern speed of global broadband in the 1st world and you can actually stream live images around the planet.  HOW COOL IS THAT?  I MEAN REALLY, JUST THINK ABOUT HOW INCREDIBLY USEFUL IS THAT?

So where even in the 70's and 80's companies needed massive and expensive global operations with local language specialisation etc to really reach a global customer base, now they can literally have on demand live training and demonstration using this stunningly useful technology.

So why oh why don't you use it to handle problems like this.  Instructional bursts of YT would literally strip thousands of support hours out of your cost base by simply pointing the problem customer to the YT pieces and then loop back a couple days later to check on progress.  Your PONC (price of non conformance) would shrink in ways you cant yet imagine and your brand equity would stop being battered by the poor quality reporting we see here constantly with the repeated age old problems.

If the answer to that question is that marketing wont let a "negative" video out the door....just refer them to the debate witnessed here about customers being capable of handling the truth, warts n all.

A clever marketing guru would use that to your advantage in the positioning.  Just think of some of the classic strap lines over the past few decades to highlight quality manufacturing versus cheaper clones:

"Some day all watches will be made this way" (Seiko)
"Stella Artois, reassuringly expensive"
"Beanz meanz Heinz" for Heinz baked beans is clearly saying there is only one choice (and the quality is tacet)

The message (not the strapline) wants to be along the lines of:

"Tormek........the pinnacle in sharpening systems innovation and manufacture for the discerning......for life.

The connotation is that by joining this exclusive family, you will be supported for life (unlike the cheaper clones who will dump product on you and run like the wind).

If it were my company (if I ruled the world etc etc) I would go far further in my digital marketing and I would have a live YT channel for the Tormek.  Regular posts would come out once per week or once a month with all manner of useful bits n bites.  One day it would be "how to dismantle" your Tormek, next, how to grind a bowl gouge......how to change the grinding wheel without buggering the shaft etc.......how to how to how to how to...on and on.  Same presenter every time so he becomes known and loved.  I would have it linked on a permanent sticky through this forum and the website.  Promote it to death as the living, breathing, modern, vibrant face of Tormek.

[Ken S]

Rob, if I am the forum diplomat as you say, then I nominate you to be the forum Minister of Propaganda.

You are correct, of course, in your comments about the widespread impact of you tubes. I must confess that even though I am a devout last century book learner, I have found you tubes very useful.  I think they are not the wave of the future; they are the wave of the present.

I refer to the Tormek handbook often.  I like having physical books for reference.  I also have the latest version downloaded on my ipad.  I suspect the updated download will eventually become the ready reference.

i believe the best example of how people prefer to learn today was Herman's posting the link to the you tube he made demonstrating his HK-50 small blade jig. It was well done and instantly absorbable in today's computer culture. (Great job, Herman!)

The production cost of you tubes is something which will not show up as a distinct auditable number on the corporate books.  Only sales revenue is recorded. Sales will occur.  Sales will go to the organization with the best presentation.  In today's world, that's you tubes.  Even very done DVDs by experts, often far superior in quality to the you tubes, do not have anywhere near the audience of the free you tubes.

From a strictly marketing standpoint, well done you tubes also limit the real competition.  The real competition is not lower priced clones.  I believe the real competition is the used Tormek market. A very satisfied Tormek user's Tormek probably won't be sold until health, age, or estate prevail.

Ken

[Rob]

 

Not propaganda Ken.....positive change management :-)

[Ken S]

Rob, if "you people"  had just used a little "positive change management" in the 1770s and used slogans like "supporting the troops" (to help pay for the defense of the colonies during the French and Indian War) instead of "tea tax", "my people" might be enjoying a proper size pint instead of having  our "positive change managers" think we were stupid enough to accept the little 16 oz. pint!

Ken 

[RobinW]

I detest phrases like 'positive change management'; 'centres of excellence', 'thinking outside the box' and other bullshit management speak.

However I fully endorse Rob's views on positive change management above, or any other terminology one might like to apply.

Have Tormek woken up to the fact that the bulk of contributors to the forum are of a certain demographic?
(ie not in the first flush of youth; liable to become grumpy and intolerant of stupidity; plenty of other experiences behind them; already own Tormek machines; have mastered a lot of the idiosyncrasies of the machine; hard nosed and determined to find solutions to problems; prepared to share their knowledge and help out those less experienced or with problems).

Those of us in that demographic have lived through seeing communications develop from paper and pencil and the humble telephone, to the web and its wide open facilities (and foibles); we all embrace these facilities to a greater or lesser extent. We are on the Forum!!!!

So what about Tormek's future customers? Most will be younger than us and if we can see the advantage of the web medium, then they will expect even more.

Have Tormek considered how much time and money they spend going to and from shows (include time preparing, travelling, overnighting in hotels, hanging around at shows etc) all or which is unproductive, and what is the real return? How many SE-76 owner problems have they solved?

Could they put a cost on the time we individuals have spent raising issues and the blood sweat and tears spent trying to get round the problems and trying to match the sales video hype? If Tormek covered these costs, even at a nominal rate, they would be bust.

If someone in the market for a sharpening system looked on this forum and saw the number of SE-76 debates, would it encourage that person to by a Tormek?

In comparison, how much time and effort and outlay would it take for an expert to do a half or one hour video addressing some of the SE-76 idiosyncrasies? No packing; no travelling; no hotels etc.. Set up a video camera or iPad and get started. It doesn't need an immaculate, word perfect, MGM standard of editing. It should be done as you would explain something in your own workshop. If required back track, repeat and elucidate how to do things.

Apart from standard online video showing how to set things up and cover the problems likely to be encountered, they could do a weekly/monthly webinar (live online forum with customer interaction). Thus and an "expert" would address problematic issue(s) as submitted to the forum. Others can contribute.

Not all things will be cracked first time, but try. Go and resolve before the next programme and come back to it if required. We're all human and we all learn.

This approach must be cheaper than sending representatives to do demos at shows.

(Even when I know more about a particular subject than anyone else on the planet, I would never call myself an "expert", hence the quotation marks.)

How many online videos are there, for example, sharpening and setting up a plane? Why do we go seeking out these things and learn from them, or discount some when we realise the presenter is off track?

Why do we look at the various woodwork shop type online programmes - it's because we see how others address issues and show how they work round them, or demonstrate their preferred methods. We all learn and appreciate the content.

My previous employer, a large world wide known corporation, set up marketing departments near some of our large customers, and wanted all queries routed through those departments. I also know that those same customers refused to deal with the marketing departments and wanted to 'speak to the horse's mouth' and deal with the guys who knew how the systems worked and who to speak to in the event of any problems. Every engineered item will have a problem at some time - that's not a problem, it's how that problem is handled by the manufacturer which is the problem.

I bet a dram or two that Tormek designers and staff have learned from contributions to this Forum, so they should also consider how they could capitalise on this collective expertise in future.

[Rob]

Rob, if "you people"  had just used a little "positive change management" in the 1770s and used slogans like "supporting the troops" (to help pay for the defense of the colonies during the French and Indian War) instead of "tea tax", "my people" might be enjoying a proper size pint instead of having  our "positive change managers" think we were stupid enough to accept the little 16 oz. pint!

Ken 

How accidentally and yet entirely appropriate Ken.  Even a Nation makes operational errors when attempting to feed an existing empire by failing to notice what is changing around it 

[kennyk]

Robin made some good points about the lack of a Tormek presence at the major annual wood show in Scotland. I attended a more local show in Hartville, Ohio. I was hoping to talk with the Tormek rep.  The Tormek rep was a no show. I ended up purchasing a sharpening product from a competitor. 

It's a moot point, as the Scotland Show has been cancelled this year. 

[Rob]

but its also academic because as Stig has said, there's just no way Tormek has the feet on the street to attend every show.  Nor would anyone expect them to have, its just not reasonable.

What is both reasonable and easily achievable is a set of instructional YTubes that require zero distribution or T&E investments since they can be piped down an existing infrastructure for nothing :-)

[Ken S]

Way to go, Robin. You have described many of us, myself included, very well.  We are not just a demographic; we are Tormek's customers.  I have no desire to run Tormek AB. I do hope the present management will improve the training options readily available to those of us who cannot reasonably be expected to travel to Sweden. I do hope these training improvements and expansion will be done in a manner which is both learning effective and cost effective for Tormek AB.  I want Tormek AB to prosper and continue to innovate.  We have seen some real improvements in recent years; I hope to see more.

I believe the tormek is a very good and versatile tool with the potential to be an even better and more versatile tool.  Some of that potential can be realized from the company's engineering and support departments.  Some can originate with customers and this forum.

Stig, I'm afraid you will be returning to work after holiday with a very full agenda.  I hope your colleagues at Tormek AB are open to positive suggestions. We have certainly offered many.

I don't believe we should expect Tormek AB to do the whole job.  I am willing to volunteer to be part of a group of individuals who would review any new company produced you tubes or videos.  In fairness to the company, I would agree to share my comments only with the company until such time as the you tubes or videos are released to the general public. The comments I would share with Tormek AB would be honest, polite and presented in a positive though critical manner.

Ken

[Ken S]

"Ken S : Here you have the video http://www.tormek.com/en/about/index.php"

Thanks, Stig.  It is a little difficult to locate, but well worth the time. (It is on the Tormek website.)  I would recommend everyone on the forum watch this short video.  Among other things it discusses the Tormek philosophy and shows some of the inspection process at the factory. I always feel more confident in a product when I see dial indicators being used in the inspection process.

Ken

[Rob]

hrmpphh

At the risk of sounding like a grumpy old man, that kind of "corporate identity" marketing just makes me want to reach for the sick bucket.

All that cost could have been sunk into YT's that actually help customers rather than seduce would be investors and shareholders!

[Ken S]

Rob, you don't qualify as a grumpy old man yet.  However, I see your point about the expenditure being chosen instead of more technical you tubes.  Are the two mutually exclusive?  Nothing gets manufactured without investors and shareholders.  Investors and shareholders get no return on their investment without customers.  Satisfied customers become repeat customers. Repeat customers make more dividends and R&D money.

I found the short glimpses of the inspection process and company philosophy interesting. I also hope to find the upcoming technical you tubes most interesting.

Ken