Good afternoon folks - I've been lurking for quite awhile but now I need some help. I keep seeing references about jig and wheel updates that are very confusing to me. I have a Supergrind 2000 that was purchased many years ago (15 or 20) and over the years I have used it very little but have done some updating. I am now ready to reacquaint myself with the tool. I would like to start by showing what I have and getting some suggestions on potential beneficial upgrades.
My sharpening is/will be limited to chisels, turning tools and drill bits. As I said I have a Supergrind 2000. I have an SG 250 Aluminum Oxide wheel that is currently at roughly 220 mm. I also have the leather honing wheel and the profile honing wheel, an upgraded water trough and a swivel base. Is there anything on the basic machine that could be upgraded. I have some concern about the wheel size and type. Is 220 getting too small? Should I be considering a different type wheel for the sharpening I will be doing?
I have a maintenance kit, a used and new grading stone (used on right in the picture below - not sure it is useable any longer - its pretty misshapen).
For straight edge tools I have the universal support and two SE 76 straight edge jigs - not sure I am completely up to date with these.
See the next post for a few more items
Rick
A couple of other things for now - a WM 200 angle finder and TT 50 truing tool. finally I found what appears to be a truing tool point but it may not be Tormek related?
I'm calling this group of items the basic machine and edge tool group. I think I'm current on everything in this group but perhaps the wheel and TT-50 but I'll let you folks tell me that :)
I do have turning tool and drill bit jigs - I'll hold off on those until the basic machine and edge tool group is resolved.
Thanks
Rick
I have that exact same machine. Love it!
The new shaft with EZ off nut is a worthwhile investment.
Kind regards,
Rich
Rick,
As you probably already know, I have several Tormeks, and no complaints. In a sense, they don't match the rest of my tools. Many of my tools predate me (1950 vintage). Part of me thinks a well worn SuperGrind should have been my Tormek. At this point, getting a SuperGrind is not practical for me. I am pleased you will be putting your SuperGrind to good service.
Follow Rich's advice. Rich and I are friends and both live in Columbus, Ohio. I have watched him work with his venerable SuperGrind. A T8 can not do anything Rich and his SuperGrind can't do. I agree with Rich that you have already added the essential upgrades. I would also second Rich's recommendation that the EZYlock is a worthwhile investment. I would interject the word "very". I started with an original shaft. I would not want to be without the EZYlock now.
Enjoy your SuperGrind. Keep posting!
Ken
Thanks Rich and Ken for the encouragement. I may have tried to cover too much at once so let me step back and ask
1. Is my wheel too small at 220 mm?
2. Is the SG wheel appropriate for chisels/turning tools/drill bits?
3. Is the univwrsal support bar at the current revision level?
More to come
Rick
Rick,
Your wheel should be good to about 180 to 200mm. You have plenty of life left in it.
The SG is designed for chisels, plane blades, etc. It may not be the ideal choice for hss turning tools. The SB is designed for them. However, Tormekers were sharpening their turning tools for almost forty years before the SB was introduced.
Your universal support bar has the current microadjust nut and threads. It is the latest version.
Ken
Thanks Ken - that's good information. The whole line of Tormek wheels is confusng to me but given my expected sharpening needs it sounds like the SG will serve me - even if I need to replace it. You probably figured out that I am not a big user and don't anticipate that to chnage much. ]y plan is to get proficient with edge tools, turning tools and drill bits so that when the need arises I have the skills to sharpen my tools.
I should have mentioned that I am trying to see where I can upgrade because there is a wood working show of sorts coming up near me (NC) and there is supposed to be a Tormek rep there - usually there is a show discount. I'm not looking to spend money just to spend it so a new wheel is likely not going to be on my list - unless there is a screaming deal :) The stainless shaft and EZY lock nut is definitely on my list.
So it seems the next question is the truing tool. I have read many times on this forum that there are several versions of the TT-50 - I'm pretty sure the one i have ( picture above) is not the latest. Will I experience a significant leap in functionality by upgrading the TT-50 to the latest version. Secondly how can I tell if the diamond cluster in my current TT-50 should be replaced?
Thanks
Rick
Rick,
One thing I would definitely put on your show purchase list is the TNT-300. I consider this the best video Tormek has made so far. There are two parts, sharpening and using the turning tools. It was made by Jeff Farris (using a SuperGrind). In addition to being one of the most experienced Tormek users on the planet, Jeff is also a very skilled turner. I consider this a "must have" for Tormek woodturners. Here is a link:
https://www.tormek.com/usa/en/accessories/other-accessories/tnt-300-woodturners-instruction-box/
I would put the MSK-250 EZYlock kit on your list.
I have both versions of the TT-50. The old version is good enough (if you encounter any chatter, it is easily corrected with electrical ties). The new version is better. If your budget permits, I think I would include it on your list. Roughly half the cost of the TT-50 is for the diamond cluster. A new TT-50 would take care of both possible problems.
The unadvertised discount is usually 20% on accessories and 10% on the Tormek itself. Woodworking shows are usually at least annually, so, if you miss a discount this year, you can catch the next street car.
The TNzt-300, EZYlock, and TT-50 should get you up and running.
Keep us posted.
Ken
Make sure you study the new TT-50 on tormek.com. I would expect a show to only handlethe new model; just make sure you know the difference.
Rick,
Here's the summary of grindstones I compiled :
http://sharpeninghandbook.info/Grindstones.html
Kind regards,
Rich
Quote from: Ken S on October 13, 2019, 11:06:47 PM
Rick,
One thing I would definitely put on your show purchase list is the TNT-300. I consider this the best video Tormek has made so far. There are two parts, sharpening and using the turning tools. It was made by Jeff Farris (using a SuperGrind). In addition to being one of the most experienced Tormek users on the planet, Jeff is also a very skilled turner. I consider this a "must have" for Tormek woodturners. Here is a link:
https://www.tormek.com/usa/en/accessories/other-accessories/tnt-300-woodturners-instruction-box/
I would put the MSK-250 EZYlock kit on your list.
I have both versions of the TT-50. The old version is good enough (if you encounter any chatter, it is easily corrected with electrical ties). The new version is better. If your budget permits, I think I would include it on your list. Roughly half the cost of the TT-50 is for the diamond cluster. A new TT-50 would take care of both possible problems.
The unadvertised discount is usually 20% on accessories and 10% on the Tormek itself. Woodworking shows are usually at least annually, so, if you miss a discount this year, you can catch the next street car.
The TNzt-300, EZYlock, and TT-50 should get you up and running.
Keep us posted.
Ken
Make sure you study the new TT-50 on tormek.com. I would expect a show to only handlethe new model; just make sure you know the difference.
There are also videos by Jeff on You Tube on sharpening specific tools.
https://www.youtube.com/user/SharpToolsUSA
Great information so far - Rich that is an excellent summary for grind stones. My take away is that the SG-250 is a general use all around stone that can be used for HSS (at least according to the Tormek site) and that the SB-250 is more specifically for HSS turning tools. Based on this the SG-250 is the right stone for me unless my volume of turning increases. Does that sound right?
Ken - I am aware of Jeff - in fact I originally bought my supergrind from him at a show. He definitely has some skills. I hadn`t mentioned before that I also have the wood turners kit and the DBS-22 drill bit jig. Part of the wood turners kit was Jeff`s video so I`m good to go with that.
Looking at the new TT-50 on the Tormek site - it seems the main difference is the way the diamond carrier interfaces with the universal support. On mine there is a whole in the carrier through which the univeresal support passes while on the new version it appears there is a fork of sorts which rides along the universal support. I`m sure there are other differences that I am not seeing. My plan is to take my TT-50 to the show and have the rep show me the differences.
A few more questions - I have the SE-76 square edge jig and I noticed that there is a newer version (SE-77). The primary difference seems to be some functionality for adjustment of squareness. I have had some problems in the past with narrower chisels so I`m thinking maybe this would be a good upgrade but am looking for opinions.
The other upgraded version I was able to identify was the SVD-185 gouge jig which has been replaced by the SVD-186. I`m not sure what the differences are. Mine did come with the shaft for turning tool insert cutters (I thought this was one of the differences between the 185 and 186) but my instructions are for the 185? Is the SVD-186 enough of an upgrade to consider?
I don't think there are any other upgrades in the turners tool kit or the DBS-22 but feel free to chime in if I missed something.
So here is my list for the show in order of priority from most likely to unlikely
TT-50 2019 truing tool
SE-77 Square edge jig
MSK-250 Shaft Kit (not sure I need this if not changing wheels frequently)
SVD-186 gouge jig
SG250 wheel
Thanks for your thoughts
Rick
Rick,
The SVD-186 is a substantial improvement over the 185. In my review, I recommend it even for those who are already using the 185. Don't take my word for it; Glenn Lucas sings its praises in one of his newer DVDs. It should be on your list.
The SE-77 is very useful if you are sharpening bench plane blades with camber. It's also nice for adjusting for square with chisels.
Ken
ps I did not mean to ignore Jeff's you tubes. I did not include them for your purchase list because they are free. We have all learned from them.
Rick,
The SB-250 is good for all tools with harder steels. Many knife sharpeners use it also.
But you are right, the SG grindstone works well.
Kind regards,
Rich
Given Ken's and others comments above I'm rethinking my purchase list - basically switching the SVD-186 with the MKS-250 shaft kit. The first three items come to $264 plus tax. The shaft kit is another $70. these prices are assuming there is no show discount.
So let me be the devil's advocate - I disassemble the shaft and was surprised at the lack of corrosion - probably reflects my lack of use :). The worst area was right at the end of the threaded section on the wheel side (1st picture below). The shaft did not want to come out of the wheel so I had to use an arbor press to separate them. After getting them apart I noticed that on both sides of the wheel where the shaft hole is there was some breakage - I'm not sure if I did that or it is normal (see pictures two and three). In any event the washers on both sides are supported by good wheel surface.
So my questions are 1) is the damage on the wheel at the shaft hole OK to use as is? and 2) Devils advocate - Why would I invest in a replacement shaft if I am not going to be changing wheels? Wouldn't periodic lubrication with a lithium grease prevent the corrosion? and if not changing wheels what advantage does the EXY-lock system give me?
Thanks
Rick
Rick,
You have a great point. I bought my Tormek 2000 in December 2002, and only replaced the shaft in June 2016. With only one grindstone, it is less critical; however you should consider one at a later date. It is definitely worthwhile when you have more than one grindstone.
And I can honestly tell you that the investment in the SVD-186 has much greater value than the new shaft change. For the wood turner, the SVD-186 is a significant leap forward from the -185. And, you can re-purpose the -185 for sharpening carbide bits. I do that for my hollowing tool.
Oh, and as for the wheel damage, don't worry about that. Once you put the grindstone in place and true it, you won't even know there was any damage.
Good luck,
Rich
Rick,
"These prices are assuming there is no show discount." At the risk of sounding crass, if a show offered no discount, my wallet would not leave my pocket.
I agree with Rich about the value of the SVD-186.
Ken
Thanks Rich for your thoughts - I`m pretty sure at this point that the shaft kit will be on hold for now. I haven't done a lot of turning lately but it is one of the areas I would like to focus on so the SVD-186 will be on the list. I`m still unsure about a new wheel - based on Ken`s previous comments - at 220 mm mine is still very useable. While the potential show discount is tempting I think I am going to wait and see if my current sharpening motivation lasts. I`m hoping it does and also hoping that my wheel lasts another year. My modified list is below - please feel free to offer suggestions relating to missing items or other thoughts
TT-50 2019 truing tool - for sure
SE-77 Square edge jig - for sure
SVD-186 gouge jig - for sure
SG250 wheel - not likely
MSK-250 Shaft Kit - not at this time
Ken - I agree about the show discount and my expectation is that there will be one. My limited experience is that sometimes the "discount" is no shipping cost. With the availability of free shipping these days - I'll be looking for some much more significant relief on prices. I have heard though that Tormek is somewhat restrictive about discount programs (at least I think so).
Rick
OK - while waiting for the show for my new jigs I decided to clean up the drive parts of the machine. Wire wheeled everything and lubricated the shaft and bearings with a white lithium grease. Got the stone and honing side of the machine back together - after a few youtube visits because my memory is about shot :).
There was a little corrosion on the universal support so I wire wheeled that as well. Now I'm cleaning up the water trough. This has been sitting dry and uncleaned for a few years so there is some sludge dried up in the trough. Is there a magic potent for cleaning this or is it just/elbow grease and the right tools fornall the nooks and crannies? Hopefully there is a magic sauce that I can let it soak in and then rinse and dry?
Thanks
Rick
From my perspective, I do not see the need of purchasing a new TT-50 unless it is functionally destroyed. I rather doubt that the diamond cutter would be shot. Judging from your pictures, it appears that you already have a second cutter? While I assume (I do not have one) the up to date new TT-50 is indeed an improvement, have you previously experienced or currently are having difficulties with the TT-50 you have?
I think like Elden. I would try using you present TR-50 on your present grinding wheel. Set it to take a very light cut, barely touching the highest spot on your grinding wheel. Assuming it does not chatter, lower the diamond less than half a number on your microadjust. Continue this way until the diamond lightly cuts into the entire wheel. If you don't have chatter: 1) your Diamond is OK 2) your TT-50 is OK 3) your wheel is trued. If all of these happen, I yould not purchase the new TT-50. If you get chatter, you can try the electrical tie fix recommended by Ionut. (Sharpco also has a video showing using a magnet as a fix. I have not tried this, although it looks promising.)
If you don't want totry either of the fixes, or if your diamond is not cutting properly, I would suggest getting the 2029 TT-50. "Innocent until proven guilty."
Eldin - good questions but it has been so long since I actually used the TT-50 that I can specificlly say there are problems with my older version. I was basing a purchase decision on others saying it was a significant improvement. Also I'm not sure how to tell if the diamond cluster is still good or not? I was planning on taking my TT-50 to the show with me and asking some questions at the show. Maybe I should try it out and see what the results are?
Ken has mentioned a tie wrap fix for chatter - but I can't find that thread
Rick
I see Ken responded while I was typing - I'm going to follow his advice I think
Rick
Quote from: Ken S on October 16, 2019, 10:33:55 PM
I think like Elden. I would try using you present TR-50 on your present grinding wheel. Set it to take a very light cut, barely touching the highest spot on your grinding wheel. Assuming it does not chatter, lower the diamond less than half a number on your microadjust. Continue this way until the diamond lightly cuts into the entire wheel. If you don't have chatter: 1) your Diamond is OK 2) your TT-50 is OK 3) your wheel is trued. If all of these happen, I yould not purchase the new TT-50. If you get chatter, you can try the electrical tie fix recommended by Ionut. (Sharpco also has a video showing using a magnet as a fix. I have not tried this, although it looks promising.)
If you don't want totry either of the fixes, or if your diamond is not cutting properly, I would suggest getting the 2029 TT-50. "Innocent until proven guilty."
OK Ken - I think you may have identified another potential purchase. My universal support has a micro adjust nut but it doesn't have numbers. I see the USB with numbers on the Tormek site. It doesn't appear you can simply buy the nut - you need to purchase the complete bar.
Rick
If you look at the parts breakdown for the T-7, the micro adjust nut with scale is #66 and is $7.95 from Advanced Machinery in Delaware.
Quote from: GeoTech on October 17, 2019, 12:51:34 AM
If you look at the parts breakdown for the T-7, the micro adjust nut with scale is #66 and is $7.95 from Advanced Machinery in Delaware.
Thanks for that info GeoTech - I appreciate it. The further I look the more I find. While looking at the USB I saw the horizontal USB base with two locking knobs. My USB base only has one locking knob. The more I looked the more I thought that the whole thing was really familiar. I suddenly remembered that I had purchased some Tormek items for a standard 8" grinder. Lo and behold I have two USB's with adjusting nuts with scale and two horizontal bases with two clamping knobs each. I should be able to put a new base and USB on the supergrind and put the lod design on the traditional grinder.
Thanks
Rick
Rick B,
I definitely would try out the TT-50 you have.
If you have not read the following thread, I think you will find it interesting.
https://forum.tormek.com/index.php?topic=3647.0
I am nowhere close to being an an expert on the subject, but I think as long as the diamond cluster cutter protrudes beyond it's holder a little, it should work. That excludes substantial damage to the TT-50 unit that might happen if you drive a Mack truck over it. ;)
Quote from: GeoTech on October 17, 2019, 12:51:34 AM
If you look at the parts breakdown for the T-7, the micro adjust nut with scale is #66 and is $7.95 from Advanced Machinery in Delaware.
Or, just mark it with numbers 1 thru 6. If you want to get fancy, use a protractor and draw lines every 60° around the circle.
Rich
Rick,
No problem with no numbers on your microadjust. The thread pitch is 1.5 mm. There are six numbers, so each number represents one sixth of a revolution or .25 mm. Eyeballing lines one sixth of the "pie" with a fine tip marker would be more than accurate enough.
If, by chance the threads are not flat on top, your support bar may have been threaded later. The thread may not match the Tormek microadjust. That's no problem. The nut you already have will work fine.
Ken
Quote from: Elden on October 17, 2019, 02:47:03 AM
Rick B,
I definitely would try out the TT-50 you have.
If you have not read the following thread, I think you will find it interesting.
https://forum.tormek.com/index.php?topic=3647.0
I am nowhere close to being an an expert on the subject, but I think as long as the diamond cluster cutter protrudes beyond it's holder a little, it should work. That excludes substantial damage to the TT-50 unit that might happen if you drive a Mack truck over it. ;)
I'm with Eldon. Unless you have the old ADV-50D diamond truing tool, use the TT-50 that you already have.
Rich
So I decided to follow the wisdom of the forum members and give my exiting TT-50 a try today. I watched a few YouTube videos to refresh myself. It seemed the results were just fine. The stone was cleaned up and looking like new with no visible lines/discrepancies.
I guess the one concern I have is that I don't know what I don't know. I have read about chatter - I don't think I experienced that but what would I look for on the stone after truing? I am assuming the chatter would be coming from the up/down movement of the diamond carrier? Is this where the tie wrap solution Ken mentions comes into play?
So assuming I'm OK with the current TT-50 - my purchase list now looks like
SE-77 Square edge jig - for sure
SVD-186 gouge jig - for sure
SG250 wheel - not likely
MSK-250 Shaft Kit - not at this tim
TT-50 Truing Tool
If I was going to splurge - what makes more sense - the shaft kit or a new wheel. I'm looking at this as I will be at the show where discounts will be available so if I may need something over the next year now is the time to purchase. I'm still thinking if I get a wheel it will be the SG-250 - unless someone has some good reasons to go with a SB-250 - I am certainly open to other viewpoints.
Thanks
Rick
The other thing I noticed was a lot of waterunder the machine - is this typical?
Thanks
Rick
Quote from: Rick_B on October 18, 2019, 02:36:37 PM
The other thing I noticed was a lot of waterunder the machine - is this typical?
Thanks
Rick
It is hard to say about how normal it is to have water under the machine. I know nothing about models earlier than the T8. On my T8, I get quite a bit of water under the machine when using the diamond wheels, but not any of the matrix stones (SG, SB and SJ). It remains a mystery why. What I have done, primarily since the diamond wheel water is laced with AC solution, I don't want to lose any of it, so I use a cafeteria tray under it and that captures the escaped water.
Rick
(https://forum.tormek.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4087.0;attach=3839)
Thanks Rick - I'm curious if others with an older model have experienced this issue
Rick
Rick, nice to see the red laser line on the grinding wheel showing the desired line of contact of the edge with the stone. :)
Jan
Rick,
Looking at your photograph, you certainly have a lot of water spillage. The only cause I can think of is overfilling the water trough. Taking a guess, I can imagine the water line in the trough being designed for an initial fill, allowing absorbtion by the original wheel. Diamond (and CBN) wheels do not absorb water. This might make the water line as being too high for them.
I think a better technique for any model Tormek is to fill the water trough to have the water just start to flow over the grinding wheel with the motor running. The wheel will continue absorbing water for about a minute. Leave the motor running and gradually add water until the water just begins to flow over the top when absorption is complete.
As I write this, I am aware that I have not sharpened knives longer than eight inches. I just purchased a ten inch Victorinox chef's knife to stretch my length. I can imagine that long knives might be more prone to water spillage. I still think the amount of water in the tray is probably due to overfilling.
I like the cafeteria tray idea, especially if the whole tray is rotated instead of lifting the Tormek. I hope you combine it with a turkey baster.
Ken
Ken - I think you may be onto something - when I tried out my existing TT-50 I remember adding water several times. I may have gone over the fill line thinking the wheel would absorb the excess. Maybe it was actually flowing out the back side a little. I'll be more careful next time and see what happens.
Thanks
Rick - but not the cafwteria tray Rick :)
Rick,
Our other Rick is from the Pacific Northwest. They use different types of "cafwateria trays" out there. :)
Ken
Quote from: Rick_B on October 17, 2019, 09:36:55 PM
I guess the one concern I have is that I don't know what I don't know. I have read about chatter - I don't think I experienced that but what would I look for on the stone after truing? I am assuming the chatter would be coming from the up/down movement of the diamond carrier? Is this where the tie wrap solution Ken mentions comes into play?
I"m still curious about the "chatter" problem mewntioned with the TT-50. I canLt find any discussion about it or the tie wrap solution. Anyone have a link?
Quote from: Rick_B on October 17, 2019, 09:36:55 PM
So assuming I'm OK with the current TT-50 - my purchase list now looks like
SE-77 Square edge jig - for sure
SVD-186 gouge jig - for sure
SG250 wheel - not likely
MSK-250 Shaft Kit - not at this tim
TT-50 Truing Tool
If I was going to splurge - what makes more sense - the shaft kit or a new wheel. I'm looking at this as I will be at the show where discounts will be available so if I may need something over the next year now is the time to purchase. I'm still thinking if I get a wheel it will be the SG-250 - unless someone has some good reasons to go with a SB-250 - I am certainly open to other viewpoints.
Show is 4 days away - any ideas on how to spend my money?
Rick
Rick,
Here is a link to a very good discussion which shows ways to correct possible chatter:
https://forum.tormek.com/index.php?topic=3053.0
Please be advised, the key phrase is "possible chatter". Many of us have never experienced it. When you use your
TT-50, have you experienced any problems?
Ken
Thanks Ken - after reading through your linked thread I don't "think" I am having the chatter symptoms described. After using the truing tool I don't see any cracks, diaginal grooves, etc - the stone appears smooth and consistent. I'm going to assume for now that the TT-50 does not need replaced.
Rick
PS - still looking for ideas to spend my money - I'm not necessarily anxious to spend $ but I also don't want to look back and think I should have bought something at a discount
Rick,
Your TT-50 sounds OK. (glad to read it!)
For the funds you really want to spend, I have two suggestions:
1) the RM-533 Rubber Work Mat
2) the RB-180 Rotating Base
These are around $60 US each. Neither is a glamour choice, however, both are very functional, and you will use them in every sharpening session, regardless of what you sharpen.
Enjoy the show, and keep us posted.
Ken
Ken - thanks for the choices on other accessories. I already have the swivel base an a reasonably good stand with a formica top so I don't think I need the rubber mat.
I went to the show yesterday (actually it was a Klingspor Extravaganze event) - Tormek had a booth but the discounts were only in the 10% range - not enough for me to buy things I MAY need in the future. I only ended up buying the SE-77 and SVD-186 jigs.
One final "getting started" question - I'm going to start with some chisels - I have quite a few that just need touch up but a couple that need complete reshaping. As a result I'm going to need to regrade the stone. As mentioned up thread I have both a used and a new grading stones. The fine side of the used stone is pretty dished/deformed (pictures below) - can I still use the fine side of this stone or should I just use the course side?
Secondly what technique improvements would reduce or eliminate the dishing - or maybe it is normal?
Thanks
Rick
Rick,
Too bad that the discount was only 10%. That seems enough to buy what you need at the time if you happen to already be at the show. It wouldn't excite me enough to drive very far just for the discount or buy much ahead. On the other hand, that may be all prudent management feels it can reasonably offer. I hope you learned things from the demonstrators, the real reason to attend a show.
I would be reluctant to use a stone grader which was worn too much to be straight. Stone graders are not that expensive. I consider them long term consumables, like grinding wheels.
Ken
I think I've read where the TT-50 at a slow speed (90 sec) will give a finish equal to the fone side of the stone grader. Does anyone use the TT-50 instead of the stone?
Rick
Quote from: Rick_B on October 27, 2019, 02:44:33 PM
I think I've read where the TT-50 at a slow speed (90 sec) will give a finish equal to the fone side of the stone grader. Does anyone use the TT-50 instead of the stone?
Rick
It gives a very coarse finish on the stone; coarser then you can do with the stone.
Good discussion. I happen to have two SG-250s. I used the TT-50 light and slow on one. I used my Sharpie on the other to divide it in half. I used the coarse stone grader aggressively on one half. I used a "coarse" diamond file card on the other half. Judging by feel, the coarse stone grader and the coarse diamond file card seemed to be about the same. Neither seemed as coarse as the TT-50.
A good follow up test would be to use the TT-50 slowly on half of the grinding wheel and fast on the other half. There is much to be learned about the grading process.
Ken
So in my efforts to reacquaint myself with the Tormek I decided tostart with the largest chisel I have (1-1/2") because I was having some trouble with smaller chisels. I got through the grinding process with what appeared to be a uniform scratch pattern. However, after honing on the leather wheel there were scratches that wouldn't go away. I'm thinking I didn't do a good job with the fine side of the grading stone. So how long do folks spend doing the fine grading? How much pressure should be used?
I have read where folks are using other diamond type stones for grading but it seems the Tormek stone should be satisfactory.
Thanks
Rick
Rick,
As part of my testing CBN wheels several years ago, I tried taking one of my Blue Chip sharpening chisels directly from my 80 grit CBN wheel to my leather honing wheel with lots of PA-70 honing compound. A long time with the leather honing wheel reduced a surprising amount of the scratches. The chisel was sharp, not super sharp, but quite usable. As a control test, I also sharpened an identical Blue Chip 3/4" chisel using the traditional three step technique. The three step chisel both looked and tested sharper.
This test illustrates the value of having multiple identical sharpening chisels. These are valuable learning tools. Many questions can be explored. What is the difference between using the finely graded SG for fifteen seconds and a full minute? The same question with the leather honing wheel. Having multiple sharpening chisels allows you to observe the process at several stages and using different processes (and different pressures).
Do not be afraid to experiment.
Ken
So Ken - following your suggestions - I went back to same 1-1/2" chisel. I regraded the stone with the fine side of the grading stone and was conscious of spending a little more time with it. Then I resharpened the chisel until I had a uniform scratch pattern. Finally I honed it and spent a lot of toime at that - I was still having trouble eliminating all of the scratches. I adjusted the USB to lower the front of the chisel just a bit. That helped a lot but there are still some visible minor scratches when viewed in the right light. It is likely good enough for the woodworking I do.
Rick
Rick,
Two suggestions:
I was curious to see if using the stone grader (fine side) for a longer period would make the stone grit even finer. My test results are somewhat iffy, however, longer time did seem to help. Try grading with the fine side for approximately ninety seconds.
Stig gave me a good suggestion. Finish with very light pressure. Grepper posted some photos of this a long time ago. I don't know what happened to them. I would definitely suggest trying to end each phase of sharpening with a light touch. Note that this is not a recommendation to use the SG with light pressure all the time, just the last few seconds.This is one of the benefits of having several "sharpening chisels". It is easy to make side by side visual comparisons.
Ken
If there are still scratches on it either you need to spend more time honing or use a more aggressive honing compound. Since you seem to be tired of the honing, I would go to a more aggressive method. Use a polishing compound with a coarser grit than the Tormek paste. Tormek polishing compound is approx. 3 microns which is about 8000 grit. Go to 4000 grit compound or coarser. 3M has a 3000 grit and most likely everyone else too. Maintain your bevel at all costs as in keep it flat against the compound backing. Do not curl it when completing a pass. This is what I would do if it bothered me all that much which it would not.
Ken - that sounds like a couple of good ideas - 90- seconds with the fine stone and lighten up at the end of the shrpening cycle. I'm gong to gove both of those a try.
Jeff - I have both the Tormek compound and Dursol - I have been usng the Dursol so far. I agree that I could easily walk away from the current level of scratches and call it good. At this point Im calling it education and an opportunity to practice :)
Thanks
Rick
Well I've been practicing with chisels and have gotten through 15 or so. I tried Ken's ideas and discovered that a longer tme with the grading stone did provide a finer finish. It seems that 60 seconds gets a fine finish and another 30 doesn't seem to get much improvement. This is based on observation - feel and sound - of the regrading process. I also tried lightening up at the end of the sharpening process. As a result I was able to sucessfully sharpen the chisels - they are not perfect/still had some visible scratches but they shaved arm hair and slit paper so I am calling them good.
I still have some issues with keeping the bevel square with the chisel edge. I'm not sure how to check squareness with the chisel installed in the edge guide - I don't have a small enough square to do that so I am relying on visual observation - not always the best method.
I have a couple of more chisels to complete then I am moving on to turning tools. Any suggestions/ideas are appreciated.
Rick
Rick,
For turning tools, make sure you have the much improved SVD-186 gouge jig and the Tormek TNT-300 Turner's Information Box. The new gouge jig is a real improvement and the Info Box is Tormek's best video.
Ken
Thanks Ken - got them both
Rick