Long knives & cleavers jig

[RickKrung]

I bought larger radial drill press with cross vise which I use for timber mortising.

Jan,

Please tell me more about your "radial drill press with cross feed".  I just posted about offering to help CB with his drill press and about having mounted a VFD to someone else's radial arm drill press.  But I never operated it in actual use, just confirmed that it ran under the VFD controls.  The notion of a cross feed is intriguing.  Do you mean something like and X and Y direction cross feed table?  I use my vertical knee mill, with DRO, in this fashion, but it is limited to just in travel the X and Y directions (although, I do have if fitted with knee milll travel DRO)

Since this is getting into non-"Tormek" territory, we may need to take this off the forum and into the PM or general personal email realm

Rick

[cbwx34]

CB,

What sort of issues have you had with your drill press?  I restored my Delta floor model, including changing out the spindle, repairing the push button switches and other stuff.  Plus I restored a 1941 Rivett 1020 lathe, which involved a lot of reworking of parts and making whole new parts by making patterns and having them cast in metal and then machining.  I want to convert the Delta drill press from single phase 110 AC to three phase by installing a VFD (variable frequency drive). I have the three phase motor but not the VFD.  I've installed VFDs on my Rivett lathe and my 6x26 vertical knee mill, as well as on two of someone else's Bridgeport mills and a radial arm drill press (Jan, I'll be asking you about yours).

If you would like to talk about it, we should probably PM each other personal emails so as to take it off the Tormek forum. 

Rick

Hey Rick, thanks for the offer.  Not really sure what's wrong, other than something is loose that makes it hard to line it up precisely.  (I'll line it up off, but when I flip it on, it'll drill in a different spot).  It's a cheap Harbor Freight many years old.... like Jan said, maybe time to be nice to Santa. 

If I get an idea what the problem is, I may give you a holler.

[RickKrung]

Hey Rick, thanks for the offer.  Not really sure what's wrong, other than something is loose that makes it hard to line it up precisely.  (I'll line it up off, but when I flip it on, it'll drill in a different spot).  It's a cheap Harbor Freight many years old.... like Jan said, maybe time to be nice to Santa. 

If I get an idea what the problem is, I may give you a holler.

Curious.  There is a lot to think about there.  It would be helpful to hear what your "line up" process entails and what your drilling procedures are. 

It is hard to imagine, if the machine's head is locked in place, how it could not drill where it is lined up, as far as machine malfunction is concerned.  Easy to think of how the lack of center-punching, center-drilling and how the width of the center drill web could lead to wandering, especially with larger drills. 

The process I use, particularly when free-hand drilling, is: 1) carefully lay it out, with caliper scribed cross-hairs for each drill location, 2) precisely center-punch each location. I use a spring-loaded punch, but careful alignment of any punch is critical.  (If the punched point is off, move it, by placing the punch center in the divot and angling the punch away from the direction it needs to move and punching again. Repeat as necessary)., 3) center-drill to create a hole that the drill cannot deviate from.  4) begin drilling, with small drills, working up in small increments,  especially for larger hole sizes like 12mm and especially when using a drill press or hand drill where you cannot control the spindle (drill) speed.  In my case, the Delta is really a wood working tool, so it's slowest speed is too fast for drilling full diameter holes in metal, especially thinner thicknesses, such as the rectangular tubing I was drilling (Hence, my interest in installing a VFD).  I worked up in size by 1/16" dia. at first, but as the hole got bigger, by 1/32" dia.  Grip the workpiece tightly, but at the same time, loosely enough to let the drill find its center in the previous hole.  This means holding the workpiece itself tightly but allowing it to float/shift under the drill's pressure until it is centered.  The drill will try to grab the workpiece and spin it as it breaks through.  Best to be holding the workpiece in a drill vise unless it is large enough to make that moot.  I hope this makes sense. 

When drilling on my milling machine, using the DRO, I often dispense with the layout, but always center-drill prior to beginning drilling.  When drilling on the mill, where the workpiece is securely held, I'll often drill full sized, or work up in larger increments. 

Rick

[Jan]

I bought larger radial drill press with cross vise which I use for timber mortising.

Jan,

Please tell me more about your "radial drill press with cross feed".  I just posted about offering to help CB with his drill press and about having mounted a VFD to someone else's radial arm drill press.  But I never operated it in actual use, just confirmed that it ran under the VFD controls.  The notion of a cross feed is intriguing.  Do you mean something like and X and Y direction cross feed table?  I use my vertical knee mill, with DRO, in this fashion, but it is limited to just in travel the X and Y directions (although, I do have if fitted with knee milll travel DRO)

Since this is getting into non-"Tormek" territory, we may need to take this off the forum and into the PM or general personal email realm

Rick

Rick, because we are discussing tools suitable for manufacturing the extension jig for Tormek, I hope we can post it here.

My radial drill press is similar to https://www.amazon.com/W1669-2-Horsepower-Benchtop-Radial-Drill/dp/B001R23SOA

My Universal 4" Cross Slide Drill Press Vise is similar to https://www.amazon.com/Universal-Cross-Slide-Drill-Press/dp/B001FGAJTA

The cross vise is mounted to the drill press table.

Jan

[RickKrung]

Rick, because we are discussing tools suitable for manufacturing the extension jig for Tormek, I hope we can post it here.

My radial drill press is similar to https://www.amazon.com/W1669-2-Horsepower-Benchtop-Radial-Drill/dp/B001R23SOA

My Universal 4" Cross Slide Drill Press Vise is similar to https://www.amazon.com/Universal-Cross-Slide-Drill-Press/dp/B001FGAJTA

The cross vise is mounted to the drill press table.

Jan

Jan,

Nice looking drill press.  And nice to have the cross slide drill press.  The type that I worked on is a bit different an larger and very hard to find.

Rick

[RichColvin]

Rick,

Is that the drill press version of a radial arm saw (which, there is a good reason you don't find sold new any more !) ?

Rich

[RickKrung]

Rick,

Is that the drill press version of a radial arm saw (which, there is a good reason you don't find sold new any more !) ?

Rich

Yes, and the only ones I've found sold new are huge, meant for metal working.  I have no interest or need for anything like that, although I would love to find and old Delta, as the one pictured.  Should the need arise, I have access to both in friends shops, but they are both 350 miles away. 

Rick

[RickKrung]

It is hard to imagine, if the machine's head is locked in place, how it could not drill where it is lined up, as far as machine malfunction is concerned.  Easy to think of how the lack of center-punching, center-drilling and how the width of the center drill web could lead to wandering, especially with larger drills. 

Rick

CB,

I didn't get into how the facet grind of a drill bit affects wandering and breakout, but there is a very enlightening thread in the Drill Bit Sharpening Forum about a four and six facet grinds on drill bit points that may be of interest to you:
https://forum.tormek.com/index.php?topic=3265.0

The DBS-22 Drill Bit Sharpening Attachment is capable of putting both 4 and 6 facet grinds on drill bit points.  The DBS-22 was a prime motivation for me to invest in a Tormek:
https://forum.tormek.com/index.php?topic=3350.0

Be sure to read the "Drill Bit Geometry" article by Joseph Mazoff, mentioned by RichColvin in that thread.

Rick

[cbwx34]

CB,

I didn't get into how the facet grind of a drill bit affects wandering and breakout, but there is a very enlightening thread in the Drill Bit Sharpening Forum about a four and six facet grinds on drill bit points that may be of interest to you:
https://forum.tormek.com/index.php?topic=3265.0

The DBS-22 Drill Bit Sharpening Attachment is capable of putting both 4 and 6 facet grinds on drill pit points.  The DBS-22 was a prime motivation for me to invest in a Tormek:
https://forum.tormek.com/index.php?topic=3350.0

Be sure to read the "Drill Bit Geometry" article by Joseph Mazoff, mentioned by RichColvin in that thread.

Rick

I will take a look... thanks! 

[Jan]

Jan,

Nice looking drill press.  And nice to have the cross slide drill press.  The type that I worked on is a bit different an larger and very hard to find.

Rick

Rick, thanks for the picture of a nice old radial drill press!

I hoped my could enable some simple milling work also, but thanks to the many degrees of freedom the construction is not sturdy enough.

Jan

[RickKrung]

Rick, thanks for the picture of a nice old radial drill press!

I hoped my could enable some simple milling work also, but thanks to the many degrees of freedom the construction is not sturdy enough.

Jan

Jan,

And depending on the way the chuck mounts to the spindle, a very bad idea.  If it is a taper mount without a screw that holds it in place (very common), with side thrust from milling, the chuck could come flying off the taper.  Drill presses are just not made for milling... 

For a number of years, I did a whole lot of good work on this type of mill:
http://www.grizzly.com/products/Mini-Milling-Machine/G8689?utm_campaign=zPage&utm_source=grizzly.com

Rick

[Jan]

Rick, thanks for your explanation. It is good to know that the mini milling machines can do a lot of good work.

Jan

[cbwx34]

Well... that was easy....   



... and it works!

(Still don't know what the deal is with the drill press... no matter how well I line things up, even with a pilot hole, it "kicks" up in one direction, away from me when I go to drill.  I just made sure I did it the same on both sides, haha, (and also so it wouldn't affect the 90mm distance).  Anyway, I'll deal with that some other time I suppose). 

Thanks for all the help! 

[Sharpco]

Well... that was easy....   



... and it works!

(Still don't know what the deal is with the drill press... no matter how well I line things up, even with a pilot hole, it "kicks" up in one direction, away from me when I go to drill.  I just made sure I did it the same on both sides, haha, (and also so it wouldn't affect the 90mm distance).  Anyway, I'll deal with that some other time I suppose). 

Thanks for all the help! 

Good job!

[cbwx34]

Good job!

Thanks.  Works great.... allowed me to "retire" the one I put together with hose clamps.