BevelCalc - Using TormekCalc2 for Plane Blade Sharpening - Angle Entry Question

[RickKrung]

I have been sharpening some plane blades recently using the black marker method.  But, I need to be a bit more accurate and consistent with some, particularly for an idea I have for rough/heavy metal removal. 

I've been studying the TormekCalc2 tab "BevelCalc", which appears to be the repository for various calculations for this sort of tool.  I think I am looking for a value like "Grinding Angle △ [º]" as used on the TormekCalc tab.  I expect this will be a forehead slapper when I find out, but could someone point me to it, please?  Or enlighten me on how to generate it.  I have selected the "jig" as SE-77. 

Thanks,

Rick

[cbwx34]

I have been sharpening some plane blades recently using the black marker method.  But, I need to be a bit more accurate and consistent with some, particularly for an idea I have for rough/heavy metal removal. 

I've been studying the TormekCalc2 tab "BevelCalc", which appears to be the repository for various calculations for this sort of tool.  I think I am looking for a value like "Grinding Angle △ [º]" as used on the TormekCalc tab.  I expect this will be a forehead slapper when I find out, but could someone point me to it, please?  Or enlighten me on how to generate it.  I have selected the "jig" as SE-77. 

Thanks,

Rick

I could be wrong, but I think you still use the TormekCalc tab.  BevelCalc is basically determining the angle based on the USB Height (or distance to the wheel).... sorta reverse of what is normally done... instead of, "I know the angle, where do I set the USB (TormekCalc) vs. I know where the USB is, what is the angle? (BevelCalc).

Could be wrong... (or not sure what you're asking).

[RickKrung]

I could be wrong, but I think you still use the TormekCalc tab.  BevelCalc is basically determining the angle based on the USB Height (or distance to the wheel).... sorta reverse of what is normally done... instead of, "I know the angle, where do I set the USB (TormekCalc) vs. I know where the USB is, what is the angle? (BevelCalc).

Could be wrong... (or not sure what you're asking).

Oh, OK.  That escaped me, for whatever reason.  I looked at the TormekCalc tab but it appears to me to be totally knife oriented and I have not found how to enter anything but knife jigs.  So, I am still missing something. 

I would be willing to work backwards, iteratively, in BevelCalc if need be, but I still don't see how that works.  I've entered my distance from USB to the wheel surface and it doesn't come even close to the angle that I'm working with.  Again, I don't see where the parameter that I want ("Grinding Angle △ [º]") is located.

Rick

[cbwx34]

I looked at the TormekCalc tab but it appears to me to be totally knife oriented and I have not found how to enter anything but knife jigs.  So, I am still missing something. 

On the "Database" line (first row) change Knives to Tools... you can then select SE-77 on the Jig row.

[RickKrung]

On the "Database" line (first row) change Knives to Tools... you can then select SE-77 on the Jig row.

Doooh!  There it is...  [slap sound in the background]  Works just like one would think. 

And the distance to the wheel turned out to be within a couple 0.1mm of what I was using, for my angle (35º).

Thanks. 

[cbwx34]

I would be willing to work backwards, iteratively, in BevelCalc if need be, but I still don't see how that works.  I've entered my distance from USB to the wheel surface and it doesn't come even close to the angle that I'm working with.  Again, I don't see where the parameter that I want ("Grinding Angle △ [º]") is located.

To answer this part (or muddy the waters), even though you'll use the TormekCalc tab... here's an example of how the two compare (TormekCalc on the left, BevelCalc on the right)...

[RickKrung]

Thanks, CB.  I guess that helps.  It took me a while to figure out the number of significant digits makes some difference and how to set it to display correctly (T USB).  It appears VUSB is a required input in BevelCalc for the Bevel Angle to calculate correctly.  I took that value from TormekCalc, but if I have to measure it as well as T USB, I don't want to bother.  That is one reason I am using T USB, so I don't have to measure VUSB. 

But, I do see how they relate a bit better. 

Rick

[jvh]

Hello CB,

thank you, I couldn't be here for a few days...

Thanks, CB.  I guess that helps.  It took me a while to figure out the number of significant digits makes some difference and how to set it to display correctly (T USB).  It appears VUSB is a required input in BevelCalc for the Bevel Angle to calculate correctly.  I took that value from TormekCalc, but if I have to measure it as well as T USB, I don't want to bother.  That is one reason I am using T USB, so I don't have to measure VUSB. 

Hello Rick,

VUSB is not required input, you can enter T USB dimension (Top of USB to wheel surface T [mm]) in BevelCalc too. But if you enter T USB only, you get angles in all Bevel angle Δ [°] cells, because this dimension is the same for all USB types and it is not clear which one you are calculating.
You can also enter T USB and VUSB together (or HUSB / FUSB) dimension, then VUSB dimension has higher priority and it will override calculated angle for VUSB. Take a look at the attached pictures for a better idea.

jvh

[RickKrung]

JVH,

Thanks for the screen shots.  They are helpful.  I tried replicating your examples, but don't get the same results, at least with some of the jig parameters that my version of the spreadsheet had as defaults. 

I looking for what other parameters are different,  I see that some of the jig dimension parameters differ for the SE-77 in BevelCalc, but these are values I can't alter on this tab. I've tried changing values in the Jig tab, and while that does change the displayed values, I still don't get the same Bevel Angle as you.  The differences are very minor and immaterial, I think.  Probably some other parameter differing in decimals. 

What would be the reason for the different jig parameters?  I am curious how you measured those jig parameters as they require some careful alignments and could make a difference in results.

I believe I get your point and can use BevelCalc. 

Rick

[jvh]

JVH,

Thanks for the screen shots.  They are helpful.  I tried replicating your examples, but don't get the same results, at least with some of the jig parameters that my version of the spreadsheet had as defaults. 

I looking for what other parameters are different,  I see that some of the jig dimension parameters differ for the SE-77 in BevelCalc, but these are values I can't alter on this tab. I've tried changing values in the Jig tab, and while that does change the displayed values, I still don't get the same Bevel Angle as you.  The differences are very minor and immaterial, I think.  Probably some other parameter differing in decimals. 

What would be the reason for the different jig parameters?  I am curious how you measured those jig parameters as they require some careful alignments and could make a difference in results.

I believe I get your point and can use BevelCalc. 

Rick

Hello Rick,

sorry, I used my version of TC2 while I experimented with another support with different diameter, so calculated results was for USB dia 15,3 mm.
I changed the pictures in the previous post, you should get the same results if you use the same machine constants.

jvh

[RickKrung]

Hello Rick,

sorry, I used my version of TC2 while I experimented with another support with different diameter, so calculated results was for USB dia 15,3 mm.
I changed the pictures in the previous post, you should get the same results if you use the same machine constants.

jvh

That could mess with things.  I changed those parameters back, so yes, I'm getting the same results now.

Thanks,

Rick