What is honing compound exactly?

[Rob]

I understand its purpose ie to assist in the removal of the wire edge created by sharpening. But what exactly is it?  Is it just cream with a fine abrasive in it?

Also if your tool isn't that blunt, can't you just strop it on the honing wheel to re energise the edge?

[Justin]

Yep it's suspended grit.

For me honing is really only for finishing and realigning a slightly folded edge. But i'm not sure on how dulled "not to blunt" is, so it's hard to say if that particular edge would need a swift run on 1000 and back on the leather or just the leather. 

[jeffs55]

Honing on the leather wheel is much like using a "steel". It is the final alignment of the teeth on the cutting edge. If all you have to do is REalign the cutting edge teeth, then you are good to go. If not, then on to the grinding wheel. Rule of thumb, if your edge will almost bite into your fingernail, then the leather wheel will most likely be sufficient. If the edge slides across your fingernail, better go to the stone. IMHO FYI The super fine stones aka 4000 grit and the leather wheel are nearly the same thing. Do not buy a 4000 grit stone to see if it is better, it is not. I have one and it is great but not better than the leather IF your edge is duller than the nail biting ability. Clearly, you can grind with the wheel but it will take till the cows come home to get anywhere.

[Rob]

Thanks chaps

[Jeff Farris]

Jeffs55 didn't quite cover that subject completely. The Japanese Waterstone and the honing wheel and paste leave a similar surface finish, but I wouldn't say they do the same thing.

The honing wheel is supple. It knocks down high spots, but also reaches down into low spots. Consequently, it also softens the line at the back of the bevel. This makes for a tool that glides on the material to be cut. As an experiment, take a couple of similar tools, grind them equally on the SG-250, using both the fast cut and then the fine cutting graded surface, then take one to a high grit (4000 to 6000) bench stone and finish the other one on the leather honing wheel. In my experience, you can get a razor sharp edge with both methods, but the leather honed tool will move through the material being cut more gracefully.

As with anything, it can be overdone. If you get the heel too soft, the tool doesn't guide well and if you bring your angle too high while honing, you can round over the cutting edge. That said, you can make mistakes on stones, too.

As for the Japanese waterstone for the Tormek, it is one of those tools that is either loved or hated by its owners, with little room in the middle. Jeffs55 is right, don't expect it to remove material on a dull tool. Its strength is in putting an edge on kitchen cutlery than needs no further refinement, but the tool needs to be in pretty good shape before starting.

[Jeff Farris]

Oh, and to get to the original question, Tormek honing compound is 6000 grit aluminum oxide abrasive in a paste carrier. Nothing dangerous or harmful in it. No fire or poison hazards, but it doesn't taste very good. 

[Rob]

LOL. thanks Jeff.  And just as I was about to spread it on a sandwich!

[Rob]

The honing wheel is supple. It knocks down high spots, but also reaches down into low spots. Consequently, it also softens the line at the back of the bevel. This makes for a tool that glides on the material to be cut. As an experiment, take a couple of similar tools, grind them equally on the SG-250, using both the fast cut and then the fine cutting graded surface, then take one to a high grit (4000 to 6000) bench stone and finish the other one on the leather honing wheel. In my experience, you can get a razor sharp edge with both methods, but the leather honed tool will move through the material being cut more gracefully.

I experimented but with a practical focus. I was turning natural edge bowls tonight and the cutting of the last few mm of bark on the inside can be the make or break of the project.  That bark has little support from either side and often wants to tear off kind of spoiling the effect of the natural edge.  One helpful avoidance strategy aside of CA glue is a very sharp bowl gouge so you cut cleanly and don't tear the bark away. I sharpened my favourite 3/8 gouge, honed etc. I then left the universal sppt on the honing wheel side. Went back to the lathe and before the tool dulled too much re-honed with fresh compound, no grinding, honing only.  That was enough to maintain a razor sharp edge.  Just had to be careful you didn't wait too long between hones.

What was noticeable was as you suggested Jeff, the tool did cut more gracefully, it positively slid through (oak in this case) and in addition to preserving most of then bark edge, it also significantly reduced tool marks and therefore the whole scraping/sanding effort needed to finish.

I then tried it on a fruit wood and I kid you not, was able to go from the gouge straight to 0000 grade wire wool to finish...no sand paper at all. 

Marvellous

[Ken S]

The honing compound is a very distant cousin to tooth paste (a mild abrasive).  i have not tried toothpaste on the Tormek, although I suspect the official version does a better job.  If only the Tormek compound had whitener.......

Ken

[Rob]

 

[Rob]

Not just sharp but completely free of plaque :-)

[Herman Trivilino]

In my experience, you can get a razor sharp edge with both methods, but the leather honed tool will move through the material being cut more gracefully.

That makes sense. I never thought about the contribution made by the polished edge.

As with anything, it can be overdone. If you get the heel too soft, the tool doesn't guide well and if you bring your angle too high while honing, you can round over the cutting edge.

Making the heel too soft?  I don't understand how that would work.

[Jeff Farris]

Making the heel too soft?  I don't understand how that would work.

When I use a hollow ground chisel, I set it on the work and "feel" the two point contact, usually, resting on the heel first and then bringing the angle up until the edge contacts the work. Then I know the edge is aligned to cut whatever is directly in front of it, without digging into the wood. It's the same concept as riding the bevel on a lathe. That tactile feedback can get lost or fuzzy if the heel is too rounded.

That said, it takes a lot of honing with the bevel way out of contact with the honing wheel to do that.