New SVD-186 Gouge Jig review

[AKMike]

If you don't have a bowl gouge yet, or are thinking of adding new bowl gouges to your collection, both Glenn Lucas and Nick Agar recommend gouges with parabolic flutes when using the SVD-186 for sharpening. They claim that it is much easier to get the proper gouge profile on the Tormek with a parabolic flute  than with straight sided V or U shaped flutes.

If you have extra money for your gouges, go with the newer powdered metal gouges, since you have the diamond wheels for sharpening. Cindy Drozda talks about that here: http://www.cindydrozda.com/html/ToolSteel.html

Mike

[Ken S]

Mike,

Thank you for an interesting and informative reply. I think I am an unusual case. I started with and plan to stay with my grandfather's Sears Companion lathe from the 1930s, his set of nine carbon turning tools, and a few newer tools I picked up over the years. While I always bought good tools for the long run in the past, I realize my tool using years are numbered. My longest debate was which Alan Lacer large skew to purchase. I was sorely tempted by his Über model. Superb steel; and a super nice handle hand turned by Alan. The steel is heavier and tapered. This is a superb tool and priced accordingly. When I was younger, I would have bought it. I went with a more practical choice. The regular Alan Lacer skew is made from M2 steel with an ash handle. It is a quality tool made by Hamlet in Sheffield. It costs $125US, half the cost of an Über. It will easily do everything I need without breaking a sweat.

Among my small collection of newer tools is a Doug Thompson 7/16" detail gouge designed by King Heiple. It is powdered metal. My non technical side purchased it because I met King. He was a fine person and an excellent turner.

I agree with you about future gouges. I think powdered metal and super alloys are the coming technology. Thanks for the tip about the parabolic shape. I like Cindy Drozda's videos.

My present bowl gouges (2) are Sorby and Glenn Lucas GL5. My spindle gouge and (2) roughing gouges are also Sorby M2. I did recently purchased a Sorby M2 beading and parting tool. I plan a balance between M2 tools for less frequently used tools and Thompson or D-Way more exotic tools for heavier use. Being a recovering tool junkie, I will probably end up with more turning tools than I really need.

Please share more of what you learned from Glenn and Nick. I am enjoying the four Glenn Lucas DVDs I purchased. I hope he will talk more about the new diamond wheels.

Enough for one reply.

Ken

[RichColvin]

As Bill Boehme said,

"We're probably near the point of examining frog hair when comes to discerning the infinitesimal differences in performance of one exotic steel versus another. I can just barely notice a difference between M2, M4, A11, M42, and some that I'm not sure what they might be."

I agree.

[Ken S]

Rich,

Interesting comment. I don't think I have enough sharpening experience to pick up the subtle differences. I tend to rely on the expertise of those whose knowledge I respect. I also prefer to spend more on tools which get the heaviest use.

Ken

[RichColvin]

Ken,

My experience is this :   The jump from carbon steel to HSS makes a difference for turning as the HSS stays sharper longer.  But even that is limited.  I see this most prevalently on very hard woods with knotty grain.

I recently saw a video (and can't find again  ) that talked about sharpness, grain size, edge retention, and smoothness of cutting.  Fundamentally, you are right in saying that the craftsman's skill makes more difference than the steel's makeup.

Kind regards,
Rich

[AKMike]

It certainly is the case that skill makes more of a difference than the tool steel. Turning tools that are sharpened with grinders have to be considered as consumables, and HSS tools just take a little longer to be consumed than high carbon steel tools. For those of us sharpening with Tormeks, however, a turning tool can easily last a lifetime of turning (unless, of course, you are a production turner), particularly if it is made of one of the harder steels. If you are going to have and use a tool for the rest of your life, you might as well go with a good one.

Mike

[Ken S]

Mike,

I remember a billboard advertising an Amish restaurant in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. The sign said, "Get to know what good is!"  Good tools can do that, also. In fact, good tools can last more than one lifetime. I have three Stanley Bedrock planes from 1909. (I'm the second owner.) The Bedrocks were the Lie-Nielsens of their day. They are a joy to use.

I see your point, Mike. Most of us do this for pleasure. Turning can be an artistic outlet. I am thrifty in most areas of my life. I allow myself the luxuries of good tools and camera gear.

Ken

[Ken S]

Welcome to the forum, John. Normally I am all for restoring older gear.  however, with the 180 and 185 gouge jigs, the 186 and 186-R jigs which replaced them are so much better. I really recommend replacing it with the latest SVD-186-R. Here is the review I wrote for the forum when the 186 was introdiced:

My new SVD-186 Gouge Jig arrived today. I was immediately impressed. It looked and felt solid. I have long believed the combination of the TTS-100 and the SVD-185 was the most versatile and well designed combination of a Tormek accessory and jig. The new SVD-186 leaves the SVD-185 in the dust.

The new jig is made of zink. It weighs 346 grams (12.2 oz). The older aluinum jig weighs 202 grams (7.2 oz).

I found the swing adjustment clumsy with the older jig. It was adequate, but a bit of a juggling act with an Allen wrench. Mine had also started to strip out somewhat.  It also tended to slip occasionally. The new jig is a real improvement in this area.The old tightening mechanism has been replaced with a larger, plastic knob. Even better, there are ratchet stops for the numbers indicating amount of swing. There is no longer any slippage. This alone would merit replacing the older jig in  my opinion. However, there is more.

The lower sleeve which attaches the jig to the Universal Support has been shortened 12mm (1/2"). This makes the new jig more convenient to use with the T3/4. I had noticed the older jig was a bit constrained at the end of movement range with the T4. The change is welcome.

The tool clamp is much improved. I never cared for the combination brass and plastic arrangement on the SVD-185. The new clamp is all zink, and holds any tools in the range very securely. Rob asked about holding a ¼" detail gouge. I don't have one, but the new clamp held my diminutive 7/16" Thompson detail gouge quite solidly.

The new jig will hold larger tools. I can see that the clamping area for tools is definitely larger (36mm instead of 25mm).  I was concerned that the extra capacity might come at the expense of secure holding of smaller tools. My concerns were unfounded; the SVD-186 holds my smallest gouge quite securely, a real improvement over the older model. I asked Rob, our forum turner, about larger gouges. Neither of us were aware of any bowl gouges too large to fit in the 25mm opening. I searched further and found that Henry Taylor does manufacture Peter Child Superflute bowl gouge in ¾" and 1" flute sizes. If  you happen to use these very large gouges, your prayers have been answered.

In summation, I think the SVD-186 represents a substantial improvement over the SVD-185. For active turners who already have the older jig, I think the new model will prove a good investment. The cost is $97 US. I have seen the older jigs reduced in price by $20 US. Frankly, I do not think that is enough of a discount to pass up the improvements of the new jig. I plan to keep my older jig only because as moderator, I may need to refer to it for future forum topics.

Ken