Hi Ken,
Quick question, the Tormek T2 looks perfect for my Knife sharpening business, only, when will it be available in the UK?
Also where can I get an English video or written instructional on this great new product.
I will always have my T7 and will use it for many jobs, however, this new T2 would be an asset to the collection of the other 3 machines I have.
Hope you are well Ken and I look forward to your reply mate.
Cheers.
Bob The Knife Grinder
Kev. You can email me your directions for an english speaking version of the T2 if you have the info.
Cheers
Bob
The Knife Grinder
I apologize Ken, I called you ' Kev ' but that's my boss's name at work.
I got mixed up, sorry.
You both have my same respect though. ( Thats how I got mixed up )
I am tired though.
Very long week working for a company and having a small business as well.
Cheers
Bob
The Knife Grinder
Bob,
Nice to hear from you again. No worries about the name slip.
I have no inside knowledge about the T2. I have not heard anything about expanding its availability beyond a very limited restaurant specialty market in Sweden.
On the positive side, let me speculate some: The T2 is built on the same chassis as the T4, including the same motor. The grinding wheel is diamond. I gather this is for grinding one brand of very hard Japanese knives. I have the impression that it has been designed to be successfully used by chefs and restaurant owners with limited sharpening experience.
I have not seen or used a T2, so I really don't know. I have the feeling that a skilled operator with a T4 or one of the larger Tormek models might not experience enough benefit to justify the cost (expensive) of a T2.
Like auto racing and the space program, I expect some of the benefits of the high tech T2 will filter into the workaday Tormeks. I look forward to that.
Hopefully Stig and Magnus will comment.
Ken
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhA4uG9MUPU
Ken, you might like this video.
I personally don't think that the wheel being diamond, has to do with one brand of hard knife. My view is below.
Similar chassis to the T4, but the support fixture is molded into it. The knife jig, has a lot less movement to it, because the stone doesn't wear, and the blades only need the angle required by a knob.
It appears MUCH simpler then the T4, IMHO. I would think this would be good for high end restaurants, apprentice type situations, and lower end "fast food" style restaurants, where kids are involved.
If this were sold in the USA, I would have recommended this, over the T-7 we have coming for the restaurant, for simplicity sake.
Bob and SADW,
That's an informative youtube. It looks like someone with both a T2 and a T4 could remove the grinding wheel, jig and honing wheel from the T2 and use them on a T4. Or, with something like the TTS-100 to correct for changes in wheel diameter, use just the knife jig on the T4 or possubly the larger (250mm) Tormek models.
Converting to use in places like the UK, assuming the commercial power is the same 50Hz 220 volt input as in Sweden, should only involve changing the plug, either permanently or with a travel adaptor. Converting to North American power should involve switching the motor to the 60Hz 120 volt version.
Beyond the electrical considerations, there may be health code issues to be met in various countries.
You make a good point about the T2 being designed for an apprentice to use. There is no grinding wheel preparation or diameter change. There is almost no jig setup. There is no issue with water spillage. The learning curve seems minimal.
With the T2 having so many advantages, why would someone choose to use a traditional Tormek for knives? The T2 has two available grinding wheels, the standard 600 grit and a 325 grit. The 325 grit wheel is used for knives which require more extensive grinding. Going strictly by grit size, the 600 grit dry wheel should cut faster than an SG or SB wet wheel graded fully fine to 1000 grit. Cutting faster introduces the possibility of removing more metal than necessary in less skilled hands. There is the possibility of both grinding debris and honing debris being scattered, as in any dry grinding operation. I do not know if this is a problem, however, both have been mentioned on the forum, and should be considered.
I do not know the size range of the T2 knife jig. It does not look capable of handling large knives such as cleavers. This does not seem to be an insurmountable problem, however it might require a future second jig.
I have seen no evaluation of the bevel accuracy of the T2 jig compared with the SVM-45 and SVM-140. It does not clamp the knife. The jig may well be as accurate, or possibly more accurate. At this point, we, outside of Sweden, do not know.
I do know that the T2 costs more than the other Tormek models. Total cost comparison should exclude the need for a TT-50 Truing Tool, Anglemaster, stone grader and honing compound with the T2.
The abrasive rubber honing wheel leaves a less polished finish than the leather honing wheel with honing compound. This may be a toothier edge, better designed for slicing.This toothiness can also be achieved with a leather honing wheel charged with valve grinding compound or a ceramic honing steel.
The T2 seems very well designed and built within its intended use parameters. It should allow restaurant staff to efficiently keep knives quite sharp. At this point, I don't know how it compares with a traditional Tormek in skilled hands for sharpening knives. In its present state, it will not sharpen anything except its intended knives.
I hope we learn more.
Ken
As to why choose a different model, that is strictly a personal decision.
I agree that it won't work for larger items like Cleavers. (via Jig, but should freehand) I would also like to know (and this would require some feedback from Sweden), about more specialized knives, as well as using the honing wheel on a serrated knife. (cimeters)
Health codes, can and do vary.
While toothy would be good for most uses, Steve might chime in, as my understanding is, for some uses in typically Asian cooking, they want the knives super polished, for fine work (slicing fish, etc). One might prefer the SJ stone over the T-2 stone.
In my case, I think other uses will be found and used by one owner. If the T-2 was out, and the above was known, I would have probably recommended it, and for the few, infrequent other uses, just visit me to use my Tormek.
Prior to this, there was an older model, that I understand was based on the full size Tormek. It was a stainless square framed sister to the square framed 2000 model, and I think aimed for butchers. (basically they require things to be cleanable by hosing down) Besides "health" departments, they have the USDA that investigates them. (different agency, not all the same functions)
I will just have to wait and see.
Thanks for the replies guys
Bob
Bob,
This has been a very busy time for Tormek. Several jigs have been redesigned. The gouge and square edge jigs being major redesigns. The T8 came into production. The website is under renovation.
For such a specialized model, a controlled limited test marketing in Sweden seems logical.Whether or not Tormek decides to expand the T2 coverage will probably be influenced by their impression of its reception in Sweden.
As you say, we will have to wait and see.
Ken
O.K. Ken
I understand.
I know I can order the T2 from Sweden and they are on the same electrics us U.K. and I have sent them an email as to the price of the T2.
I only wish it could be a bigger model as in the T7. I think the new T2 is the same size as the T4.
I need to find out if the T2 will be able to accommodate the volume of knife grinding that I require.
personally I think it needs to have the same volume capability as the T7.
Even the knife jig with the 10 - 15 - and - 30 degree angle type jig joined to the machine would be good but on the T7 with a blackstone or even any stone.
The Jig alone would be at least 1 step ahead.
Here is hoping.
Cheers.
Bob.
Sorry, I got the angles wrong.
I think they are .
10
15
20
degree angles actually.
Bob
l
Bob,
As I recall, the last time you posted, you had an SG-250 wheel ground down enough to need replacement. I believe you were ordering an SB-250 as a replacement. If so, would you please post your thoughts on using the two wheels?
I also recall that the need for resharpening of the carvery knives in your specialty area was increased due to the choice of material of the cutting boards. Because of this, do you have to begin with your grinding wheel graded coarse?
Are most of the knives you sharpen carbon steel or a harder alloy? Are they mostly all the same size?
While the specialized technology of the T2, especially the diamond wheel, might indeed improve your working efficiency, I believe it is important to continually strive to increase your efficiency by a continual focused effort to maximize your skill. This is not directed at you personally; most of us, myself certainly included, could benefit from continually learning from observation and honing our technique.
I have learned the most about knife sharpening from observing and questioning Steve and Stig of this forum. I have been most fortunate in being able to observe Steve both working and teaching, both in person and from careful multiple watching/studying his Sharpening School DVD. I have not yet had the opportunity to watch Stig sharpening in person or on video, however, I have learned a lot from him through questions and answers. Both Steve and Stig have evolved beyond basic Tormek technique through years of much focused sharpening. I always try to be self aware and grow in my own skill.
I was pleased to see Steve demonstrate how he prefers to have his regular and thin knife jigs protrude the same amount, measured from the universal support to the edge of the blade. I had been using identical protrusion as one of the cornerstones of my kenjig technique. It was encouraging to see that Steve also valued it.
I have come to believe that uniformity is the key to success with efficient use of the knife jigs. I won't rehash the whole kenjig technique. I will only state that you should be able to have your universal support distance and jig protrusion set for the day before you even see a knife. Both need never change, or change only in very unusual circumstances. Your setup time with the knife jigs should only be clamping and unclamping. In my opinion, both the black marker and Anglemaster should rarely be necessary. Neither should much, if any adjustment of the jig protrusion.
If you are using your knife jigs this efficiently, if the T2 jig is "a step ahead", it is a very small step.
If your grinding wheel is freshly trued and graded, either at the end of a workday or before you start to prepare for the next day, you will dramatically reduce your lost time due to gremlins. If you need to retrue during a workday, I find it more efficient to have the TT-50 attached and preset to a second universal support. By keeping your grinding wheel trued on a very regular basis, your wheel will last longer. By keeping your bevels very consistent in repeated sharpenings, both the knives and the grinding wheel will last longer. Both you and your customer will be pleased.
As in any business, you must assess it the cost of capital investment in a piece of machinery (T2) is fully recovered by an increase in revenue due to higher efficiency and if the T2 would be the most efficient use of that capital. In short, will spending the money for a T2 or any tool result in more or less money in your wallet?
Do keep working and keep us posted.
Ken
Quote from: bobl on September 04, 2016, 10:45:46 PM
Sorry, I got the angles wrong.
I think they are .
10
15
20
degree angles actually.
Bob
l
The major described ticks of the T2 knife jig scale are 10°, 15° and 20°, but the full range of the scale is from 8° to 22°. All mentioned angles are bevel angles.
In my understanding the T2 knife jig will work on T7 and T4 also, provided the USB is set properly. There may be a minor issue with the degree pointer.
It would be interesting to know if the jig was designed for flat blades or whether some angle of the blade was assumed. ;)
Jan
If I may....
After talking to some other restaurant folk I know, most of whom have experience with 16 year olds, I would like to ask Tormek to consider making it worldwide available. Why you ask.....
Hearing horror stories about the wide spread of kids cognitive functions. I can say the lack of a water tray and stone, of the T-2, will keep a lot of stone debris from going down drains. That was not an aspect I would have considered.
Jan
"In my understanding the T2 knife jig will work on T7 and T4 also, provided the USB is set properly. There may be a minor issue with the degree pointer. "
No, the jig is not only fixed with the supportbar, it is also set in the arm attached in the top of the machine. So there is no way to use it on a regular Tormek.
Best,
Stig
Stig,
thank you for your clarification. It is a pity, I like the T2 knife jig concept. :)
Jan
I understand why the knife jig is permenently attached to the T2. The target market is experienced restaurant owners, chefs, and less than experienced other employees. They may or may not have any previous sharpening experience. A non detachable jig fits the "stone simple and indestructable" criteria of high school shop teachers.
Jan, the curious Tormek imp in me would like to test drive the jig both on a T2 and on a regular Tormek. :)
Ken
The same is true for me, Ken. :)
My original idea was that on regular Tormek we will lose the bevel angle info because we do not have the special T2 top arm, but Stig statement indicates there is some principle reason why we can not use it on a regular Tormek.
Anyway I rejoice the simple and smart design.
Jan
Quote from: Jan on September 05, 2016, 03:36:26 PM
It would be interesting to know if the jig was designed for flat blades or whether some angle of the blade was assumed. ;)
Jan
From the picture with above, and from the video, where they appear to slide the knife in the black housing, it would appear that some angle is assumed. (maybe designed for an average)
With as thin as it is, personally, I think it looks more designed for stamped knives (typical restaurant knives). As NSF and other sanitation groups, require plastic handles (no rivets or places for contamination) that you don't typically see on forged knives.
Those tend to be somewhat angled, during the grinding process. I don't expect that most restaurant users would go as far as to figure out the angle of the knives and adjust for it. (real world experience)
EDIT: forgot one word that changes the meaning of the sentence. Brain faster then hands.
I agree with you, SADW. The T2 knife jig can accommodate knives with blade thickness up to 3.5 mm and 14 – 60 mm height.
I think the T2 knife jig may work well when we are sharpening knife belly or tip and want to keep a constant bevel width. Using a standard knife jig it is not always easy to achieve it.
Jan
I actually like this and would probably buy it. Especially if I knew what the UK price is.!!
If someone was professionally regularlysharpening a lot of knives which were thicker, I think it would be cost effective to have a machinist modify the knife jig, as Wootz did.
Ken
Hi Ken,
I prefer the SB250
However, I just recently lost a very large contract with the Carveries to a national company since the carveries were taken over bye a major brewery and wanted them all under the same supplier. ( Gutted ) Virtually ruined me. I used the tormek for these guys as it was mainly carvers all the same setting and big volume, generally around 25 knives per restaurant. However, the business I have left is with small pubs and bistros etc, which do not warrant the set up time for the T7, a hand full of blades 3 or four per outlet.
I am currently using other machines from the van as opposed from setting up in the kitchen. Having problems with the right battery though, hence my other forum topic.
Still interested in more info on the T2 though.
Point of interest. I use C.B.N. on an interlocking wheel technique and one of the selling points of this system is that no water bath is required.
I look forward to views.
Cheers.
Bob
Ken,
Tell me what wootz did with the machinist, ref T2 jig? or put me in touch.
Cheers
Bob,
I think this link will get you to Wootz' topic about modifying the knife jig:
http://forum.tormek.com/index.php?topic=2962.0
You might try clicking on Wootz' name and then on send a message just below his profile.
I am at a real disadvantage on advising you on the T2. I have never seen one. I will make a few guesses for you: Even though the T2 wheel is diamond instead of CBN, I think Tormek's decision to use it on the T2 is an indicator that it works well at slow (Tormek) speeds dry. For magnetic steels, the CBN wheel is the desired choice.
What I am getting to is that I think you could put together a reasonable facsimile of the T2 by combining a CBN wheel with a T7, T8, or T4. You would need to use the regular knife jigs, which should be no problem for an old Tormeker like you. (Added bonus, no need to compensate for wheel wear. Setup should be a breeze.)
Do contact Robin. Also, I suggest you contact support in .Sweden (support@tormek.se). Stig's crew may be able to help you directly or put you in touch with other Tormek users is a similar situation.
A good electric motor/generator/inventor technician would be worth getting to know. This might be a dealer.
I am very sorry to hear about your cancelled contract. This contract was pivotal in setting up your business. It's cancellation must be especially frustrating for you because it occurred through no fault of yours. I hope your perseverance will eventually be rewarded.
Keep posting. You are among friends.
Ken
I think there's another business opportunity for Tormek:-
If the T2 jig does not work with the T7, then Tormek should make a similar jig for the T7.
Look at the amount of Forum postings concerning knife sharpening (excluding unusual types and cleavers etc which come into their own categories)
Despite my reservations about demonstration videos (explained below) if the T2 can sharpen knives as readily demonstrated by the above referenced video, then I would have no hesitation in buying a similar jig for my T7.
Why? Because I cannot sharpen knives well. I haven't spent a lot of time at it, I just manage to mangle (ruin) a few and haven't put in the hours required to overcome my, or the existing knife jig's, shortcomings. If I had a jig where I slot in the knife at the set angle, swipe in and out a couple of times and have a near perfect result, I would pay the money. QED.
With regard to demonstration videos, I bought my T7 after watching Jeff Farris' demonstration video for sharpening a chisel he had deliberately butchered. What a selling point! However, as will be seen elsewhere on this Forum, it took me a lot of practice to master the SE-76 and some of its quirks, but I would now consider myself pretty proficient at chisels and plane blades - which is the bulk of my requirement.
How many other demo videos have you watched, yet when it's your turn, there's always something not quite right and it takes ages to resolve?
Robin,
Thanks for posting a very honest message. I thought I was the only one who had difficulty learning the knife jig. We really do need more in depth instructional video, and not just for brand new tormekers.
The real reason I developed the kenjig was to simplify knife sharpening. Speed was just a side benefit. I wanted to simplify knife sharpening by lowering the number of immediate skills to master. One must learn the several skills involved in both setting the Tormek and knife in the jig AND grinding the knife bevels.With the kenjig, the tormek and knife jig set up are essentially on auto pilot, allowing all available remaining brain cells to be focused in grinding.
I'm a pre multi-tasking Neanderthal who likes to built a house one correctly placed foundation block at a time. Things like study and the kenjig help me do that. I hope they also help other forum members.
The T2 knife jig looks like it could be modified for conventional Tormek's without too much effort. I agree, it would be nice if Tormek would made it available in a T4,7,8 version.If not, maybe we could go in the back door and put one together from replacement parts. "Fortune favors the brave."
Ken
ps Talking about demonstrations that work better at the show and not so well at home, I remember a comment Dave Hout made his dovetail routing class. He wondered if there was a particular micro adjustable jig in the shop. He opined that it was probably on top of the cabinet in the corner collecting dust. Sure enough, it was there, another victim of a pursuasive demo which didn't work so well at home.
One issue is when it comes to knife discussions, we need to decide what style of knife!
Ken is famous for saying practice with a 3/4" chisel. My practice has been with a typical 8" chef's knife, as well as a 6" serrated utility knife. Two different skill sets.
I have yet to do a roast slicer, boning knife, or a cleaver (haven't dulled them yet), or one of several other styles. I have freehanded a pocket knife (just needed a touchup), where it needed just a hit then more honing.
I think an 8" chef's knife and Jeff Farris video is the way to start. I don't think longer will do much other then cost you more. It might teach the skill set of how to avoid hitting the other wheel. I was tempted to buy another roast slicer to practice and learn with the longer knife jig on flexible knives, that would help me learn to avoid (or remove) the leather wheel.
Yet I think it might be a different skill set for learning the small knife jig, which my father has more practice with, with some carving stuff.
The T2 to me, seems like a quick and easy way to sharpen a knife for people like my restaurant friends. As it took me less trys to learn the chef's knives, then the serrated knives. But for those that time matters more, it takes me longer to setup the machine, then to do the actual sharpening.
Interesting comments, SADW.
I have found a number of well done youtubes discussing the selection and use of kitchen knives recently. They are done by chefs. By a wide margin, the "go to" knife is the chef'knife. While some prefer a longer knife, eight inches seems a popular choice. My humble home kitchen experience would verify this. My go to knife is my eight inch chef's knife, which also happens to be my only chef's knife.
I am presently rewriting my 3/4" chisel topic. My original intent was to keep it short and concise. With over sixty replies, it became bloated. When I complete the rewrite, I will have the administrator float the present frozen topic and freeze the new one in its place. It should be like the welcome topics, with no replies attached. Comments will be welcome, just not directly in the topic.
For knife sharpeners, I would make the chef's knife the second learning tool. I put the chisel first because it is a much simpler edge to sharpen. It has only one bevel to sharpen. The bevel is straight. The bevel in only 3/4" long. The bevel is wider than a knife, therefore it is easily seen. The Anglemaster measures off the large, flat back of the chisel. The square edge holds the chisel very securely and is itself securely held by the universal support.
The chisel exercise is more about becoming familiar with the Tormek than sharpening the chisel itself.
Tormek has been continually redesigning and upgrading its machines, jigs and accessories. The square edge jig has been redesigned several times, each time being an improvement. The micro adjust universal support and TT-50 truing tools are substantial improvements. The present Anglemaster is head and shoulders above the former model. The list goes on.
The new SVM-45 is an improvement. In my opinion, I see further redesigning for the knife jigs. They should be self centering to compensate for different knife widths. I would also like to see the adjustable stops modified to be less tippy.
Even with the kenjig and substitute target, I still find knife sharpening more difficult than sharpening chisels.
Ken
Quote from: Ken S on November 27, 2016, 06:02:50 PM
Robin,
Thanks for posting a very honest message. I thought I was the only one who had difficulty learning the knife jig. We really do need more in depth instructional video, and not just for brand new tormekers.
The real reason I developed the kenjig was to simplify knife sharpening. Speed was just a side benefit. I wanted to simplify knife sharpening by lowering the number of immediate skills to master. One must learn the several skills involved in both setting the Tormek and knife in the jig AND grinding the knife bevels.With the kenjig, the tormek and knife jig set up are essentially on auto pilot, allowing all available remaining brain cells to be focused in grinding.
In each set of knives for sharpening I found at least one which is a challenge for me. Usually it is a knife whose sides are not parallel or a knife which width is too small (less than 15 mm).
In the attached picture you can see knives I have sharpened today. They are all brand knives, two Japanese, two German F.Dick and Swiss Victorinox. The challenging knife today was a Victorinox with smaller blade width even more tapering towards the edge (the second attachement).
In the second picture you can see my experimentation in replacing the knife jig knob by a longer bolt. It helped to improve the jig's grip but the blade centring was not easy.
Jan
Jan,
Would a wider Jig like the SVM-140 be better for the knife in the 2d picture? I have an older SVM-100 that I use on similar knives at home.
Kind regards,
Rich
Rich,
I have an SVM-100 that I use for sharpening my six inch slicer knife with the kenjig. I use the newer SVM-140 with my eight inch chef's knife. The regular SVM-45 is quite capable of handling either of these knives. Using three jigs allows me to leave the jig "pre set" for the knife type and almost completely eliminates the need for jig adjustment.
Ken
The Victorinox in the second picture, is it a flexible blade or a stiff blade. The longer jig works for the flexible knives, but in JF video, he uses the short 45 jig, for a 13" stiff blade knife. Boning knives like Jan's second picture, are sold as both flexible and stiff blade.
Rich, Ken and SADW thanks for your responses. :)
The blade of the Victorinox knife in the second picture is stiff, so I have used the short knife jig.
I have considered the long knife jig also. My idea was that this jig may grip the blade more firmly because of larger static friction between the jig and the blade.
Finally, my major problem was not a weak jig's grip, but blade centering with respect to the jig axes. In my understanding the knife jig was designed for blades with parallel sides. When the sides are not parallel, the blade tappers towards the edge, than the centered blade has only limited contact with the jaws of the jig. Such a blade mount is unsteady, however I used it.
When one side of the tapering blade rests on the fixed jaw than the edge is not centered with respect to the jig axes. The consequence is well visible difference in bevel height between sides. :-\
It is probably better to use a suitable (Herman type) platform in this situation. :)
Jan
This makes me wish I had better luck at thrift stores. Some of my "practice" knives were bought inexpensively, but I can't get over the if it isn't broken habit, to dull them, to sharpen them.
You can also vary your pressure on the sides, to adjust for some of the offset tapering. I was annoyed at one I did, and extra passes on one side, and lower pressure on the other, improved that.
Yes, more pressure helps in many cases. :) In my case, when the jig grips only 2 or 3 mm of the blade which is even more wedge-shaped then I always try to apply as small pressure as possible to avoid blade loosening. ;)
Jan
Stig, are you killing my dream here!!!??
you are saying that I can not use the T2 jig on my T7.?
If not, I would like to get in touch with Tormek to buy the T2 machine for use over here in U.K.
I have tried to clock on the link but nothing happens.
I have also left a message on the european supplier and as of date, had no reply.
Help!!!!
Cheers.
Bob.
Stig,
are you sure about the T2 jig not fitting with the T7 machine with the T2 wheel ???
Bob
nothing from Brimark, however, I have been able to get to a french web site.
It has the T2
Happy days.
Price ain't too bad .
I still have to find out the price of replacement wheels or re-plated wheels before I can purchase.
So it is still a waiting game.
Arrrghhh.
Bob
Bob,
Living in the US, I am not that familiar with European geography. With the new chunnel, is it possible for you to drive to the store in France and take a look at the T2?
Ken
Bobl,
I sure am killing your dream ;-) The mounted jig on the T-2 cannot be used on any other Tormek machine.
Best,
Stig
What I have not read is any evidence stating that knives sharpened on the diamond wheel of a T2 are sharper in a useful way than the same knives sharpened on an SG or an SB. Nor have I read that sharpening with the T2 is faster for a skilled operator.
The jig on the T2 does look clever and well suited for relatively unskilled operators. Being curious and a Tormek junkie, I would probably buy one if it would work with the conventional Tormeks. I would not expect it to work any better than the regular knife jigs, nor do I expect enough faster jig set up time than I can accomplish with the kenjig or traditional Tormek technique to warrant the cost of the jig.
We live in a global era. We can purchase or sell almost anywhere on the planet. Bob, if the T2 is your dream, just order one from the cutlery dealer in one of the three countries. If you do enough business with it to require resurfacing the diamond wheel in the future, you will probably have earned enough to buy a second T2 and a new van. Not a bad situation; best of luck.
Ken
OK
What about using the T2 wheel on a T7 machine with no water to sharpen knives but with the usual jigs and angle master??
Is there a reason why you are not considering a CZN wheel?
Ken
Quote from: Ken S on December 12, 2016, 10:01:46 PM
Is there a reason why you are not considering a CZN wheel?
Ken
Probably the wife would kill him if he bought a (C)ubic (Z)irconia (N)ockoff. ;D
How many wives, mistresses and girlfriends proudly display their (unknown to them) cubic zirconium engagement rings and other jewelry? ;D
Ken
ps the cost of a cubic zirconium ring AND a well equipped Tormek is probably less than a genuine diamond, although that choice may have unintended side effects......
SADW,
Please be understanding with my poor keyboard. It works very well, often better than the operator. :)
No worries. I have a damaged finger, which slows me down on the keyboard. Also, this did make me laugh, which I really needed after the stressful day yesterday, otherwise I would have probably just went on without posting.
Glad my typos make you laugh! ;) With my typing, as a regular part of this forum, you will never want for entertainment.
I am embarrassed to admit that the typos you enjoy are post proof reading....oops.
Ken