Chisel BESS Readings, Please

[darita]

I've been working on chisels and would like to have some comparison BESS readings to shoot for.  Theoretically, I would think they should be like knife readings, but I'm not sure that relates to real world. 

[John Hancock Sr]

I recently watched a sharpening video from Jonathon Katz-Moses here https://youtu.be/GBjiEmN5HzA and he was getting results in the 110-120 range after stropping. For 25 - 30 deg bevels this seems to be about right.

[darita]

I recently watched a sharpening video from Jonathon Katz-Moses here https://youtu.be/GBjiEmN5HzA and he was getting results in the 110-120 range after stropping. For 25 - 30 deg bevels this seems to be about right.

Thanks John. I'll for sure watch it. I'm used to getting below 100 with knives, so I wonder why the difference?

[Ken S]

John, I watched the well done video you recommended. As an occasional woodworker since 1962, I have used most of those methods. Like in the video, I found that they all work.

Several years ago, I reviewed some CBN wheels for the forum. (80 and 180 grit used with Honerite Gold) Out of curiosity, I ground one chisel with the 80 grit wheel and went directly to my leather honing wheel with PA-70. The bevel still had significant scratches after significant stropping. I had a BESS reading of 135. For comparison, I also sharpened an identical chisel with the traditional Tormek method: SB-250 graded coarse; then graded fine; then stropped with the leather honing wheel with PA-70. The scratch pattern was much finer. The BESS reading was 100.

Please note that my test was not really scientific. Only two chisels were sharpened. I did not make a jig to control the chisel.

I have not used my bench stones in years. The three step Tormek method produces edges of quite adequate sharpness for me.

Ken

[darita]

Good video and thanks Ken, for your input.  100 BESS gives me something to shoot for.  My initial thought was that I should be getting the same BESS readings for chisels that I get with knives, which is between 50 and 100, but that hasn't been the case, so I was wondering why.  My journey continues, I guess.

[darita]

I just tested these chisels and got around 120 BESS.  Is there anything you can tell me about the edges from these pics?

[darita]

Here's a tighter shot...

[darita]

Well, I am able to get my readings down to around 100, so I guess I'll be satisfied with that for now, although I see no reason why I shouldn't be able to get them down closer to 50.

[Ken S]

Danita,

As an anchor point in the BESS system, the BESS 50 blade is a new double edge razor blade. To approach that with a chisel, it should be thinned to the thickness of a double edge razor blade. That thin a chisel would quickly crumble. Do a workmanlike sharpening job on your chisels and perfect your chisel usage technique.

Ken

[darita]

I've sharpened knives to 12 and 15 dps.  Would that be the same as sharpening a chisel to 25 to 30 degrees?

[Ken S]

Darita,

Knives and chisels are different tools for different functions. BESS is primarily designed for knives. 50 BESS is one end of the scale, the reading of a new double edge razor blade. (The edge will start to degrade from contact with air, by itself it is not a very practical master. Paper or wood cutting tests are more useful with chisels.  I Suggest you watch the online class on chisels and planes.

Ken

[darita]

I finally tried trailing edge on a chisel and found quite a different in the edge.  There was much less chipping and a smoother operation altogether.  Problem is, it's difficult to set up the leather wheel.  I used a felt wheel with 1 micron diamond and that really got rid of the burr.  And by the way, I was able to get an 87 BESS reading without much stropping.
Ken, is there an easy way to set up the leather wheel side when the SE77 is setup for trailing edge grinding?

[Ken S]

Darita,

The "easy way" is to standardize. That's why I developed the method of using the TTS-100 to set up chisels. It automates Projection, Distance, and automatically self corrects for differences in wheel diameter.

If you want to, you could go one step further and interchange a second support bar for your leather honing wheel.

I recently posted a description of how to set up the TTS-100 for chisels. (It is not an approve Tormek method).if you cannot find it, let me know.

Ken

[RickKrung]

Darita,

The "easy way" is to standardize. That's why I developed the method of using the TTS-100 to set up chisels. It automates Projection, Distance, and automatically self corrects for differences in wheel diameter.

If you want to, you could go one step further and interchange a second support bar for your leather honing wheel.

I recently posted a description of how to set up the TTS-100 for chisels. (It is not an approve Tormek method).if you cannot find it, let me know.

Ken

Ken,

Please post a link.  I did a couple searches and didn't come up with it, at least that I could tell I'd found it. 

Thanks,

Rick

[darita]

Ken, it seems no matter how I configure USB and SE77, when I switch from grinding to stropping, I'll have to turn the chisel 180* in the SE77...is that right?  And yes, I'm using the TTS100 to set USB to wheel surface.  Also, I'm using your system for trailing edge use on both grinding wheels and leather strop.  Can I do that?  It doesn't seem to be working on the leather strop side.