Set the grinding angle only via the length "Jig projection length X"

[Thomas S.]

Hi there,

while watching several Tormek grinding videos on YouTube, I came up with the following brain teaser.
Maybe this topic has already been discussed, then sorry for the repetition and I will delete the post immediately!

No idea if this is practical, but my idea would be to set the grinding angle only via the "Jig projection length X".

A prerequisite for this "variant" would be grinding wheels with the same diameter (e.g. 250mm Diamond Wheel).

And now the idea: the jig projection length X, the height of the vertical USB height and frontal vertical base height for a "medium" grinding angle (e.g. 15°) are set once with the software and checked. The settings on the Tormek should no longer be changed.

The grinding angle is then only set via the "Jig projection length X". You could build "stop gauges" for a wide variety of grinding angles and would be very fast and the angles possibly well reproducible.

No idea if this is feasible and useful?

Hopefully the google translation makes sense!

Kind regards
Thomas

[John_B]

Thomas, welcome to the forum.

On the Home Page do a search for "Ken jig". This will lead you to a vast array of discussions on this subject and the programs to set USB distances based on the jig/knife settings and USB height. For many of us this is all we use for accurate sharpening and honing angle setting.

[Ken S]

Thomas,
Excellent idea.You are in good company. To best follow this path, do a member search for "Dutchman" (Ton Nillesen) and follow his posts starting in 2013. We have all benefitted from his work. There is always room for innovation.
Please feel free to share your thoughts!

Ken

[cbwx34]

Hi there,

while watching several Tormek grinding videos on YouTube, I came up with the following brain teaser.
Maybe this topic has already been discussed, then sorry for the repetition and I will delete the post immediately!

No idea if this is practical, but my idea would be to set the grinding angle only via the "Jig projection length X".

A prerequisite for this "variant" would be grinding wheels with the same diameter (e.g. 250mm Diamond Wheel).

And now the idea: the jig projection length X, the height of the vertical USB height and frontal vertical base height for a "medium" grinding angle (e.g. 15°) are set once with the software and checked. The settings on the Tormek should no longer be changed.

The grinding angle is then only set via the "Jig projection length X". You could build "stop gauges" for a wide variety of grinding angles and would be very fast and the angles possibly well reproducible.

No idea if this is feasible and useful?

Hopefully the google translation makes sense!

Kind regards
Thomas

Nothing wrong with your idea... as mentioned this is basically an extension of the KenJig.  The Kenjig takes a set USB height, and wheel size, assumes you want to sharpen at a specific angle, (say 15 deg.), you then clamp the knife and adjust the length to 139mm.

So, you're just adding to that... for example if you had everything set for 15 deg., where the jig length was 139mm, but had a knife you wanted to sharpen at 18 deg. you'd just change the jig length to 134mm.

I believe Dutchman's book, found in this thread, has a chart if you need a reference... or you could use one of the calculators to obtain the info you need.

[Dutchman]

...
No idea if this is practical, but my idea would be to set the grinding angle only via the "Jig projection length X".
...

In my proposal (see link in my 'signature') I use the jig projection length as variable, as you suggest.
To enable a range of different sharpening angles and different stone diameters, the adjustment options of the jig however are not sufficient.
That's why I used the USB distance to the stone as a parameter, variable in steps.

[Thomas S.]

Hi there,

hello john.jcb I've been on the forum since mid-2019. Wasn't active in the last year, but check the forum from time to time and read interesting posts.

Thank you for your quick and above all helpful replies!
Thanks for the links, now I have quite a bit of information to read! 

Best regards
Thomas

[Ken S]

Thomas,

Do not become discouraged. When this forum is going at its best, we bounce ideas back and forth, refining them with each bounce. Join in the conversation.

Ken

[Thomas S.]

Hi,

now I've had time to try it and I'm very happy with the result.

I entered the following parameters in Duchman's Excel table "2 USB to stone distance table":
Stone SG Ø 245 / JC 12mm / JG 139 => 15° = S = 79mm
Leather Wheel Ø 220 / JC 12mm / JG 139 => 15° = S = 82mm

With my stop gauge / marking gauge I actually set 79mm for the SG Stone and 83mm (15-16°) for the Leather Wheel (see photos).
The check with the Tormek gauge WM200 actually confirmed the 15°.

But now I wanted to ask again whether the measurement on the universal support was correct?
From "above" the universal support onto the Stone / Leather Wheel. Or should I have somehow corrected the radius (6mm) of the universal support and my result was random?

If I understand that correctly, the table is an ingenious tool that can also be used perfectly on any bench grinder. "No matter" how far horizontally and vertically the universal support is from the grinder, as long as the Ø, JC, JG and S correspond to the calculation from the table, the angle should fit.

I think it's awesome that you pass on your efforts / tables so freely.
Special thanks to Ton and of course everyone else

best regards
Thomas

[cbwx34]

Hi,

now I've had time to try it and I'm very happy with the result.

I entered the following parameters in Duchman's Excel table "2 USB to stone distance table":
Stone SG Ø 245 / JC 12mm / JG 139 => 15° = S = 79mm
Leather Wheel Ø 220 / JC 12mm / JG 139 => 15° = S = 82mm

With my stop gauge / marking gauge I actually set 79mm for the SG Stone and 83mm (15-16°) for the Leather Wheel (see photos).
The check with the Tormek gauge WM200 actually confirmed the 15°.

But now I wanted to ask again whether the measurement on the universal support was correct?
From "above" the universal support onto the Stone / Leather Wheel. Or should I have somehow corrected the radius (6mm) of the universal support and my result was random?

If I understand that correctly, the table is an ingenious tool that can also be used perfectly on any bench grinder. "No matter" how far horizontally and vertically the universal support is from the grinder, as long as the Ø, JC, JG and S correspond to the calculation from the table, the angle should fit.

I think it's awesome that you pass on your efforts / tables so freely.
Special thanks to Ton and of course everyone else

best regards
Thomas

Although Dutchman's Table says: "USB-center to stone distance" I entered your numbers in a calculator, and the answer in the table matches actually measuring from the top of the USB to the Wheel.  So, from what I can tell the way you measured is correct.

Dutchman? 

[Dutchman]

...
Although Dutchman's Table says: "USB-center to stone distance" I entered your numbers in a calculator, and the answer in the table matches actually measuring from the top of the USB to the Wheel.  So, from what I can tell the way you measured is correct.
...

In my document, in paragraph 4 "Adjustment of the grinding angle" it is clearly stated that the distance is measured to the top of the USB:
K = length of jig between support-top and Knife edge
S = distance from support-top to the Stone

[cbwx34]

...
Although Dutchman's Table says: "USB-center to stone distance" I entered your numbers in a calculator, and the answer in the table matches actually measuring from the top of the USB to the Wheel.  So, from what I can tell the way you measured is correct.
...

In my document, in paragraph 4 "Adjustment of the grinding angle" it is clearly stated that the distance is measured to the top of the USB:
K = length of jig between support-top and Knife edge
S = distance from support-top to the Stone

I think it's the wording on the spreadsheet ("USB-center to stone distance") that caused the confusion.
Thanks for the clarification.

[Thomas S.]

Hi,

thanks for your efforts and replies!
Great, now it should be really clear to me.

Yes, if you can read and read carefully, you have a clear advantage. 

With best thanks
Thomas