Water Trough Vibrating

[jobewan]

Hey All,

First time poster, been lurking for a while.  Love me my T-8!  I am just getting diamond wheels for it - I have the DF-250 and now the DE-250.  Don't know if I will go for the "coarse" stone at this point.  It is a chunk of change and do I really need it?

So - to my question.  My water trough vibrates like crazy while I am doing anything on the T-8.  It is loud and annoying, and as I watch more and more videos featuring Tormek's, I realize how abnormal it is.  The trough vibrates a lot!  Sharpening is very meditative for me, and this vibration really disturbs the process!   I have the T-8 on the Tormeok rotating stand, and that sits on the rubber mat Tormek offers.  All of that sits on a solid steel table about knee height.  I sit while sharpening - my back isn't all that great.

So when I turn the unit on, I get the vibration almost immediately.  It occurs constantly, unless I touch the tank.  If I gently push the tank towards the wheel no more than a 16th of an inch, the vibration stops.

I would love to stop it permanently somehow.  Is it worth getting a new tank?   I know its under warranty, but the hassle of dealing with support is less than appealing.  If the tanks aren't expensive I will just buy one.  But before I do I was wondering if any of you have experienced the same problem, and if so, how you deal with it?. 

Thanks Folks - as I said in the beginning - I love this thing.  Glad to be here.  Any help is most appreciated.

Joe

[Ken S]

Joe,
Welcome to the forum. I am puzzled by your comment:

"I would love to stop it permanently somehow.  Is it worth getting a new tank?   I know its under warranty, but the hassle of dealing with support is less than appealing.  If the tanks aren't expensive I will just buy one.  But before I do I was wondering if any of you have experienced the same problem, and if so, how you deal with it?."

Have you actually had a hassle dealing with Tormek support? If so, I would be very surprised. I deal with support frequently, and have always found the support staff friendly and willing to go the extra mile.

I would certainly not purchase a part, which may or may not be the problem, while your T8 is still under warranty.
I would contact support (support@tormek.se) and inform them of your problem.

Keep us posted.

Ken

[RickKrung]

Following. 

Mine vibrates also and will cease if I press in like you do.  The vibrations on mine are not anything as bad as yours sounds (or perhaps I am much less meditative).  I'm very interested in what, if anything, you find as a solution. 

I suppose we could rig a tensioning device, but that just should not be necessary with such and expensive and well built machine. 

Rick

[RobinW]

I have had the same issue with my T7 - as posted some years ago (buzzed like an angry bee)

It is some form of resonance being amplified by the tank. Take the tank off, little noise.

I tried several things, like tying down the outer edge of tank to frame using masking tape; rubber pads between tank mounting lugs and frame. changing bench/table on which it was used; operated whilst level or at a small angle; cleaned up the drive wheel surface etc; all of which were noticeably ineffective!

I don't use my T7 very much these days, and it's some while since it was last in operation, and I'm sure the last time I used it was noticeably quieter than previous!

I apologise that I have nothing concrete to offer as a solution, but sympathies that you are not alone.

[cbwx34]

Here's my fix... if you flip the trough over, you'll see two little "tabs" (circled in red in the pic) at the end where the arms slide on.  I taped a thin piece of rubber on top of these tabs, and it pretty much took care of the vibration, plus the trough sits better against the machine so less water that runs down leaks thru.


(The picture is the bottom of the trough). 

[jobewan]

CBWX34 - that is a great suggestion - I will try it as soon as I can and let you know the verdict.

Ken - I apologize, I didnt mean to make it sound like I had any problem dealing with Tormek support, I work in the IT industry and I have had my7 fair share of annoyances dealing with support providers.  I am sure Tormek is a responsive lot, I just was hoping to find a quick solution.  It may be that CBWX34's reply is the needed fix.  I will lwt you know.

RickKrung - if the solution suggested by CBWX34 is at all effective I will let you know. 

Thanks to everyone for their responses.  Much appreciated.

Joe

[RickKrung]

Here's my fix... if you flip the trough over, you'll see two little "tabs" (circled in red in the pic) at the end where the arms slide on.  I taped a thin piece of rubber on top of these tabs, and it pretty much took care of the vibration, plus the trough sits better against the machine so less water that runs down leaks thru.

CBWX34 - that is a great suggestion - I will try it as soon as I can and let you know the verdict.
...snip...
RickKrung - if the solution suggested by CBWX34 is at all effective I will let you know. 

Thanks to everyone for their responses.  Much appreciated.

Joe

Thanks.  I will just go try it myself.  I have a small sheet of the "sliding film" as a replacement part for the scissors jig, that I have not used for anything.  I will try sticking some of that on those tabs. 

Great idea, CB.

Rick

[RickKrung]

I could not tell if CB's trough differs from mine, but it looked like it does.  I looked at and fiddled with the trough a bit and tried it with the motor running, but the stone off.  I felt another way of applying a cushioning was to use the "sliding surface tape" that I have to the back of the trough where is slides up and down close to the machine case was a potential approach. 

I checked how the vibrations seemed to occur and held the trough a few times to see if that stopped the vibration.  It did and it appeared that filling the gap between the rear of the trough and the machine with the sliding tape might work.  A key observation, sort of visible in the video but definitely in person, was that the vibration seemed to be coming form the rapid, intermittent contact between the upper part of the trough and the case.  (In looking at the video and photos now, it may have been enough to put just a pad of tape right at the top of that area, instead of all the way down.)

Trough Before video

So I tried it.  I cut shaped strips to match the area where the trough slides and applied them to the trough. 




I considered putting it on the machine case, but that would have taken more tape.


After putting the tape on, the trough was substantially more quiet.  It was even more quiet when I put water in the trough. 


Trough After video

It will be interesting to see if this fix still works once a grinding wheel is on the machine.  I fully expect it will.

Thank you CB,

Rick

[Ken S]

Well done, Rick!

Ken

[cbwx34]

I could not tell if CB's trough differs from mine, but it looked like it does.  I looked at and fiddled with the trough a bit and tried it with the motor running, but the stone off.  I felt another way of applying a cushioning was to use the "sliding surface tape" that I have to the back of the trough where is slides up and down close to the machine case was a potential approach. 

I checked how the vibrations seemed to occur and held the trough a few times to see if that stopped the vibration.  It did and it appeared that filling the gap between the rear of the trough and the machine with the sliding tape might work.  A key observation, sort of visible in the video but definitely in person, was that the vibration seemed to be coming form the rapid, intermittent contact between the upper part of the trough and the case.  (In looking at the video and photos now, it may have been enough to put just a pad of tape right at the top of that area, instead of all the way down.)

Trough Before video

So I tried it.  I cut shaped strips to match the area where the trough slides and applied them to the trough. 


I considered putting it on the machine case, but that would have taken more tape.

After putting the tape on, the trough was substantially more quiet.  It was even more quiet when I put water in the trough. 

Trough After video

It will be interesting to see if this fix still works once a grinding wheel is on the machine.  I fully expect it will.

Thank you CB,

Rick

I think anything on the arms or bottom of the trough will help... I found putting the piece at the end like I mentioned earlier... basically caused the trough to lift or tilt? toward the machine... holding it with a bit of pressure. as opposed to "cushioning".  (Don't really know how to describe it I guess).

But mine was loud... your "before" is quieter than my "after"!    

[jobewan]

Hey Folks,

I tried all of the suggestions  and they all had some effect, but didnt really solve the problem.  I posted a question with a video to the Tormek Support site.  They responded with the following:

That was a very noisy water trough you have..  I am sorry about that..
I think the vibration is from light contact between the water trough upper edge and the housing.
Sometimes it can accidentally happen that the legs on the elevator has been bent downward.
A perfect water trough should be lightly pressed against the housing at the upper edge.
The locking lugs are intended to press the water trough against the housing.
This can be cured by bending them lightly upwards.


I tried the suggestion - took a 3/4" pipe clamp and used the pipe as a lever - bent the tangs that hold the trough up slighty - no more than a millimeter or two, and problem solved!  I am really psyched.  A huge thank you to Mats Wuolo at Tormeki support for the help.

I also wanted to say thanks tio the many folks out there who responded.  Very much appreciated!  The Internet can be a fantastic thing.

JB

[cbwx34]

Hey Folks,

I tried all of the suggestions  and they all had some effect, but didnt really solve the problem.  I posted a question with a video to the Tormek Support site.  They responded with the following:

That was a very noisy water trough you have..  I am sorry about that..
I think the vibration is from light contact between the water trough upper edge and the housing.
Sometimes it can accidentally happen that the legs on the elevator has been bent downward.
A perfect water trough should be lightly pressed against the housing at the upper edge.
The locking lugs are intended to press the water trough against the housing.
This can be cured by bending them lightly upwards.


I tried the suggestion - took a 3/4" pipe clamp and used the pipe as a lever - bent the tangs that hold the trough up slighty - no more than a millimeter or two, and problem solved!  I am really psyched.  A huge thank you to Mats Wuolo at Tormeki support for the help.

I also wanted to say thanks tio the many folks out there who responded.  Very much appreciated!  The Internet can be a fantastic thing.

JB

Well... at least I got the "tilt toward the machine" right.

But, bending things with a pipe wrench... you're braver than me! 

[cbwx34]

This thread was brought up (in Facebook)... and reminded me...

I ended up using the "fix" Tormek suggested of bending the arms up slightly... it worked!

[Scotty]

How did you bend them?
They seem to be plastic- I fear I might snap them off.
Thanks

[Naf]

Mine rattled so loudly (sitting on mat only), couldn't have conversation. It stopped only when touching the USB or with a jig against. Within less than a day, I moved it/ mat to a workbench and it utterly silence now. What it had been sitting was the bottom half of an old computer "desk", on plastic wheels, made from 5/8" particle board, top surface of which I'm certain not perfectly flat anymore, having owned it almost 30 years. Point is, you might be able cure this simply be relocating it. I did. And I've adjusted it a few inches, several times... still complete silence. Other thing I considered is first location had no support directly under it, so may have caused a "resonance thing"; second locations on a substantially thicker bench but perhaps of equal importance, nearer the legs. Congratulations to anyone get that dam thing shut up,  however you do it. Thank you for other solutions above, should it ever start griping at me again!