Help With Old 2000...

[darita]

First let me say that I'm new to this forum and thank you for allowing me in.  I have an old Tormek 2005 and have used it very little over the several years I've owned it.  Recently, I began concentrating on learning how to properly sharpen my planes irons and chisels, using stones and honing jigs.  I soon realized that forming a new bevel using stones or sandpaper takes way too long.  That's when I thought, why not use my little used Tormek.  My first results were less than stellar, as I could not get a an edge that was square to the body.  I learned about the SE-77 from another website and viola...square edges, pretty much.  From there, I regraded the sone, then stropped and now I'm able to get edges that rival my stones.
So, how often should I reflatten the stone?  It seemed that after every chisel and iron I did, the stone was no longer completely flat.  If ones should reflatten that often, how long will the wheel last?
Now that I know my old Tormek works well, I'm wondering if it's worth it for me to ditch the old model and get a new T8?  Are things better on the T8, than they are on the old 2005?  The two machines look so much the same that I just don't know.  Help please.

[cbwx34]

First let me say that I'm new to this forum and thank you for allowing me in.  I have an old Tormek 2005 and have used it very little over the several years I've owned it.  Recently, I began concentrating on learning how to properly sharpen my planes irons and chisels, using stones and honing jigs.  I soon realized that forming a new bevel using stones or sandpaper takes way too long.  That's when I thought, why not use my little used Tormek.  My first results were less than stellar, as I could not get a an edge that was square to the body.  I learned about the SE-77 from another website and viola...square edges, pretty much.  From there, I regraded the sone, then stropped and now I'm able to get edges that rival my stones.
So, how often should I reflatten the stone?  It seemed that after every chisel and iron I did, the stone was no longer completely flat.  If ones should reflatten that often, how long will the wheel last?
Now that I know my old Tormek works well, I'm wondering if it's worth it for me to ditch the old model and get a new T8?  Are things better on the T8, than they are on the old 2005?  The two machines look so much the same that I just don't know.  Help please.

Welcome to the forum.

I'll let Ken give the long version of flattening/truing... the short version seems to be what you're doing... light truing often is better than doing a large truing seldom.  I think you're fine in that area.  (Ken'll tell you why).

No reason to replace the old Supergrind2000 with the T-8... nothing about the T-8 is an improvement sharpening wise. IMO.  In fact, I think the older model had better/tighter tolerances than the T-8.  The only thing you might consider, if you haven't already, is the Stainless Steel shaft with the EzyLock Upgrade... worth it IMO.  But you're Supergrind2000 is otherwise still an excellent machine. 👍

[RichColvin]

Derek,

I have that machine, and it is running awesomely.  No need to upgrade.

CB is right, you should look to move to the new shaft as part # MSK-250.  You can order it from Advanced Machinery (https://www.advmachinery.com ) or Amazon (https://www.amazon.com ... which I believe ships from Advanced Machinery)

And, I you have the older ADV-50 truing tool, you really need to upgrade to the TT-50.  The TT-50U is one you can order which doesn't come with the diamond tip, as you can move the one in the ADV-50 to the TT-50.  That's what I did.  Saved $20 or $25 if I remember.

I also upgraded my universal support bar to the micro adjust one (US-105).

Other than that, I've not changed out any parts of my Tormek T-2000, and don't plan to do so in the near future.  The T8 is a good machine; I particularly like the water trough lift mechanism. 

I will probably get a 2d machine sometime soon, and I will consider it then (vs. looking for a used machine).  Advanced Machinery will work with a buyer to take off the base package stuff that isn't needed.  For example, I have all the grindstones, so I'd probably order one without a grindstone.  I also have all the other add-on devices like the WM-200, so no need for duplicates.  Makes the T8 more affordable.

If you're wishing to ditch your old machine, do reach out to me.  I am interested ...

Kind regards,
Rich

[darita]

Thanks for the replies.  I have the TT50 and the new support bar.  I'm wondering what the MSK250 will give me?  Will it allow me to use diamond wheels if I choose or do I already have that capability?  I'm also surprised to hear that my old machine may have tighter tolerances, as the T8 is supposed to have "tighter tolerances on tool rest mounts", which insinuates that the old machines weren't up to snuff.

[cbwx34]

Thanks for the replies.  I have the TT50 and the new support bar.  I'm wondering what the MSK250 will give me?  Will it allow me to use diamond wheels if I choose or do I already have that capability?  I'm also surprised to hear that my old machine may have tighter tolerances, as the T8 is supposed to have "tighter tolerances on tool rest mounts", which insinuates that the old machines weren't up to snuff.

The MSK-250 makes changing stones a breeze... that's the biggest thing, especially if you're going to be switching between stones.  It's also stainless steel, some of the old shafts on the 2000s weren't, and can rust.  You can use the diamond stones with the current shaft, but having used both, I think you'll appreciate the "quick change" feature, if nothing else.  I know I do.

If there are "tighter tolerances..." on the T-8... I'm not seeing it.  I do see more play where the Support Bar goes into the machine, particularly in the vertical position, (and a leather wheel that has more wobble).  Maybe in manufacturing it's tighter since it's all one piece?... but in use, I'm not convinced.  (All IMO, of course).  Not saying it's terrible on the T-8... just a difference between the two, and saying I don't think it's worth the upgrade (that you asked about).

Hope that makes sense. 

[Ken S]

Derek,

Welcome to the forum. Which is the better machine, your old SuperGrind or a new T8? My answer would be whichever machine happens to be in the more skilled hands.

Do not  do or buy anything until you can sharpen one chisel. If you have misplaced your handbook, register your Tormek online using the website. (www.tormek.com). You have no remaining warranty, however, registering your Tormek will allow you to access, download, and/or print the latest efition of the handbook. The handbook is essentially unchanged over the years.

Look at the top of this section on the forum (tips and techniques). Work with one 3/4" chisel intil you master it. Your time will be well repaid. Be patient. You will soon be proficient with the Tormek if you go slow and organized.

I must pick up my grandchildren. Dowmload and read the handbook. You can do this.

Ken

[cbwx34]

Well, since Ken didn't talk about the truing, I'll quote one of his earlier posts...

As an amateur sharpener, I have nowhere near the wheel wear or time constraints a professional sharpener would have. (My profile probably fits most of the forum,) I retrue frequently, prefering frequent and light to running out of true. I like to use several very light passes, usually half a number (.05 mm) cuts. Usually three or four of these light passes does the job. I stop when the pass hits the entire wheel.

Retruing this way usually trues the wheel with only a millimeter or less loss in diameter. That's an average of twenty five mm or one inch diameter loss in twenty five retruings. For me, that is a lot of sharpening done with a true wheel.

I look at grinding wheels and other abrasives as consumables, like brakes on a vehicle. Admittedly, they are long term consumables. I see replacement costs as just part of operating costs.

Ken

(He explains it better than I would).

[Ken S]

Well stated, CB. 

Ken

[mcase]

Hi Darita,
I have a 2000 there was only one thing ever wrong with it.  The drive wheels back then then were plastic and routinely cracked along the axis of the pin from the center on out.  I went through three.    In all fairness to Tormek, I should point out  they replaced one, but they just kept breaking.    When I learned that Tormek came up with a new zinc wheel I immediately replaced my last oft-epoxied wheel.  As far as I'm concerned this is all water under the bridge.   The reason I mention it is to help you out not bash Tormek.   But, I will state that many of these "upgrade" kits are huge waste of money because the one thing they don't supply is the awesome zinc wheel.    If you have a an earlier Tormek the drive wheel is where I would start.    For me the new wheel was like a Christmas present because my 2000 is a whole new machine.    Everything else on this machine is solid!    There are consumable parts that wear o course.     You might look at your axle as they wear at the bearing points and this could lead to play.   On mine the plastic bearings held in enough steel slurry to start abrasion,  though I'm not ready to replace the Axle yet.     All the Best

[darita]

Hi Darita,
I have a 2000 there was only one thing ever wrong with it.  The drive wheels back then then were plastic and routinely cracked along the axis of the pin from the center on out.  I went through three.    In all fairness to Tormek, I should point out  they replaced one, but they just kept breaking.    When I learned that Tormek came up with a new zinc wheel I immediately replaced my last oft-epoxied wheel.  As far as I'm concerned this is all water under the bridge.   The reason I mention it is to help you out not bash Tormek.   But, I will state that many of these "upgrade" kits are huge waste of money because the one thing they don't supply is the awesome zinc wheel.    If you have a an earlier Tormek the drive wheel is where I would start.    For me the new wheel was like a Christmas present because my 2000 is a whole new machine.    Everything else on this machine is solid!    There are consumable parts that wear o course.     You might look at your axle as they wear at the bearing points and this could lead to play.   On mine the plastic bearings held in enough steel slurry to start abrasion,  though I'm not ready to replace the Axle yet.     All the Best

Wait...don't go!  Where is the drive wheel located and what should I look for?  More specifically, mine is a SuperGrind 2005.  Is that the same as what you have?  Sorry I'm not more up on these things.

[Ken S]

Derek,

Mcase makes a very good point. Here is a link to the drive wheel:

https://advanced-machinery.myshopify.com/products/0023-drive-wheel

In my opinion, the use of cast and machined zinc has been a major step forward in Tormek development. I replaced the original drive wheel on my T7. Mine was not cracked, and was still perfectly functional. I am somewhat of a Tormek junkie. My car is standard issue; my Tormeks get "tricked out". The new drive wheel, which is interchangeable with yours, is a real improvement. In addition to being much stronger with the zinc instead of the plastic, the rubberlike material is a new patented substance.

When you disassemble your Tormek to clean and regrease your bushings, examine your drive wheel for cracks. If yours happens to be cracked, I would recommend replacing it. If it is not cracked, I would reuse it, being mindful to make sure the alignment pins engage when you reassemble your Tormek.(This sounds more complicated than it actually is. The three pins and sockets are large enough to see easily; just eyeball it and rotate your drive wheel until the drive wheel clicks in.)

While your Tormek is disassembled, examine your shaft. If it has not rusted, I would continue to use it. As you disassemble your shaft, lay the parts in order. A little organization goes a long way! The task is not difficult. You will need a 3/4" or 19mm wrench.

The nylon bushings are easily wiped clean or replaced. Incidentally, the EZYlock replacement kit includes a new set of bushings.

Your 2005 is essentially the same as a new T8. The Tormek is a hearty species. I would replaced whatever parts needed. If the present parts are in good condition, they may well outlast the owner. ( Hopefully many years away.

Many years ago, I helped my father-in-law grind the engine valves on my 1965 Ford. The experience gave me a much better understanding of how the motor worked. In a similar way, the annual shaft cleaning and regreasing has given me a much better understanding of how the Tormek works. It will help you, also.

The Tormek is a great machine; all this is very worthwhile. Patience and persistence.

Ken

[darita]

Thanks so much for the information.  I had no idea.  Is there any video on the replacement of wheel and shaft?  Anything written, besides what you've already written?

[Ken S]

Derek,

I found this:

https://youtu.be/IX96a9WoAJE

Ken

ps. My oversight. I found this with a google search. I was thinking it should have been located on the MSK-250 tab of the Tormek website. So it is! I found it easily there.

[darita]

Ken, thanks.  You've been a big help.  Once I saw that it was not a big deal, I disassembled my SuperGrind.  It took a bit to get the SJ250 off and the nylon? bushing that it rides on was a bit torn up.  Also, lots of rust on the main nut, washers and shaft.  I think I'll go back in and take some pics, so I can post a thread, asking what I should keep and what I should replace.
I see now that it's a pretty simple system, so I'm not that intimidated by it all.  I just didn't want to risk throwing anything off.  Thanks again for all the help.