basic question, first one!

[Xoney]

Just rec my new Tormek T8, it's out of the box and initial setup is done.  Now it's time to do homework.  In the meantime.  Is it harmful to leave the stone soaking in water, or should the trough be emptied, if so, how often?  How long do you experienced users leave the stone in the wet trough? 

[Herman Trivilino]

If you leave the grindstone in a wet trough it will quickly wick up the water and it will be evaporate. Meanwhile, if you start the grindstone spinning it may be off balance due to wet side being heavier.

It's good practice to empty the trough after each session.

You change the water when it gets dirty. I'll typically change mine every 30 minutes or so during a busy session, but usually only change it between sessions.

[Ken S]

Welcome to the forum, Zoney.

Herman's answer is spot on, good, solid technique. I would only add one thing: With the water trough on the T8, you can raise and lower the trough. Fill the trough to the level line. I find one notch down from the top works well with a new stone. The very top notch helps compensate for a worn wheel.

If you lower the trough, the grinding wheel should sit above the water.

One quick second idea. Before removing the water trough to dump the water, removing most of the water with a turkey baster makes the procedure much smoother. Every Tormek user should have a turkey  baster.

Remove the trough by grasping it with both hands and gently pivot the bottom out. Practice this dry several times to get the hang of it.

Do keep us posted and don't be shy about asking questions.

Ken

[jeffs55]

Every Tormek user should have a turkey  baster.
Ken

I do not know what kind of turkey baster you fellows are so fond of. The one that I have when placed in the water, the bulb is squeezed and released causing a vacuum which sucks up liquid. Then, when you remove the baster from the liquid, as soon as it rises above the liquid line, it leaks all over the place. There is not enough "suck" to retain the liquid in the bulb.

[Rem]

Keeping in mind that I am not a commonsewer of turkey basters .....  my first guess is that you have a pinhole or similar break in the integrity of the baster bulb.  If it has enough "suck" to fill the baster, it should be able to hold it.  R.

[jeffs55]

If you hate dull scissors, then I suspect you are not in the "sewer" at all. However, if my 99¢ baster is not good enough for you; then you are an elitist, repressive, subversive, extremist ideolog. NOT. I may have to face the harsh reality that 99¢ is not an end all to product performance.

[Ken S]

Jeff,

At the risk of sounding like an elitist braggard,  my turkey baster cost $3.99. It does have the advantage of not leaking.

Ken

[Rem]

If you hate dull scissors, then I suspect you are not in the "sewer" at all. However, if my 99¢ baster is not good enough for you; then you are an elitist, repressive, subversive, extremist ideolog. NOT. I may have to face the harsh reality that 99¢ is not an end all to product performance.

I can certainly appreciate and understand your apparent outrage concerning my veiled suggestion that your turkey baster might be less than top quality.  I meant that in the most non-accusatory way.  My comment, however, was "baste" on the information you presented.  I will not continue to "gobble" on about it, and I'll just "suck it up" and REMain silent on the matter. 

Perhaps a wet / dry vacuum is in your future.  R   

[Ken S]

Touché, Rem.

Be careful, Rem. The Canadian Politeness Constabulary may be monitoring this forum, and you may risk being exiled to the land of the impolites to the south.

Ken

[Rem]

Touché, Rem.

........ and you may risk being exiled to the land of the impolites to the south.

Ken

Go ahead and shoot me now !!!!!      R

[SharpenADullWitt]

The T-8 with the screw lift, it is much easier to raise and lower the water tray, so there really is less reason to leave it soaking.  With my 2000, and T-7, if I am going to be back, sharpening something within an hour,  I might leave the porous stone in the water, so it takes less time to get back to grinding.
Can it be harmful, well yes, depending on the environment. I wouldn't want to leave it in water in a freezing environment.  But in the old days, long term storage in water, would cause the stones to rust to the old shafts, prior to them being stainless steel.  That issue is no more. (unless you buy a used older machine)
If your going to store the stone in water for any length of time, remember the T-8 is rated for continuous duty, so leaving it on, should be no problem. (and I believe there is supposed to be some Feng Shui about running water  )
I empty my trough at the end of every day's session.  If I am sharpening something else, later that day, then I drop the tray until I am back to using it.

Congratulations, and welcome to the forum.

[Ken S]

Steve had both Tormeks running when I met  him. He told me people will ignore a non running Tormek, but be fascinated with water flowing over a running Tormek.

Ken

[Xoney]

Thanks, everyone!     I emptied out the tray when I put the machine to bed for the night.  Thx for the tip on tray height. 
I sharpened two 3/4 chisels last night, one came out great, the other one was more mangled and needs some more work, but it's still a whole lot better than it was.  I learned that the machine needs to be on a lower table, I think, and I want a tray under it as when I used the stone grader I spilled more water than I should have.  I like the 180 degree spinning base (somebody here recommended that right off the bat) and the quietness and quality. 

My previous sharpening has been with jigs and diamond stones.  I sharpen mostly woodworking chisels and hand planes.  This works really well, but it takes forever, especially when the backs need flattening and the bevels are out of whack.  I'm looking forward to progressing through the sharpening backlog with the Tormek and returning  to the enjoyment of using the sharp tools rather than staring at a pile of dull sidelined and neglected ones. 

Highland woodworking just put out a couple of tutorial videos that helped a lot:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eavazeeF8tA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCV1EkboiGo

[Ken S]

 Xoney,

Several issues:

First is table height. Most tables are too high. A good starting point is the recommended working height on page 39 of the handbook: 550-650mm or 22-26". I have seen several height recommendations in different handbooks. This one is for knives, but seems a good starting place.

If you happen to have a Workmate, the lower height setting is not bad. I suggest making a simple, sturdy table made with 2x4 legs, basic stretchers, and a plywood top. Length and width can be flexible. Matching the size of the Tormek Rubber Mat is a good starting point. Most work benches are much too high.

You will see a maximum fill line in your water trough. Start by filling the trough with the grinding wheel in place. Let the wheel run for a while to absorb water and add water only to the fill line. The video link you provided had the trough overfilled. Not overfilling will cut down on your water spillage.

The video did not show it, however, carefully pivoting the bottom of the trough away from the Tormek is the best way to remove the trough. I don't recall the handbook covering this, either.

If you are serious about not spilling water, get a turkey baster. (a good one). I have mine labelled TORMEK to prevent accidentally using it in the kitchen. A turkey baster and one or more black markers are ESSENTIAL!

If you are chopping hand cut dovetails with a very sharp chisel and start to notice the chisel is not cutting auite as well, sharpen it or switch to another sharp chisel. At that point, touch up sharpening is very fast and efficient. If you have a well made and maintained chisel routinely sharpened, sharpening will not take long. Cheap, poorly designed, and very dull chisels naturally take longer.

I felt the video made a good start with using the TT-50 Truing Tool. I would go a bit farther. Locking the tool to the universal support is a must!!!! I would start to learn it by making very shallow cuts, about half a number. Begin where the diamond barely touches only the high spots. make several passes lowering it very gradually. Pay attention to the sound and feel of the grinding. Continue until you reach a light continuous cut. Do this early and often. In fact, a new grinding wheel should be trued before using it. Do not let the wheel get far out of true. It will last longer if you keep it true. You will avoid many sharpening gremlins with a true wheel. You can make deeper cuts when needed with more experience.

The work you do is precious, whether it is building a highboy, a turned project or a gourmet meal. The grinding wheel is just part of the process, like brake shoes on a vehicle.

I think the video understated the time with the stone grader. Spend longer than you think you need at first to get the feel of the thing. About forty seconds won't let you down.

I was not impressed with the chisel flattening part of the video. If you hold the back of your chisel against a straight edge (a good rule will do), ideally the back should be dead flat. In the real world, as long as both the edge and top of the back touch, a small amount or concavity won't hurt. It the chisel has a "belly", and only the middle touches, you have problems. If the chisel is new, return it. Flattening a belly is labor intensive. I would avoid it unless the chisel has great sentimental value to you. The worst chisels are the highly polished brands with a radius where the back meets the sides instead of a sharp corner. You have to grind away the thickness of the radius, which can take many hours. Avoid these chisels.

Flattening the backs is a good reason to start with only a couple chisels, instead of a compleat set, which includes seven sizes you will have to flatten but never use. A half inch chisel by itself will go far, as will a three quarter inch chisel. Add a quarter inch, and you have covered most of the waterfront.

I prefer to flatten chisel backs by starting with wet or dry sandpaper glued to thick glass. That will tell how out of flat the tool is. Using the side of the Tormek wheel cuts down on the labor. Use the side of the wheel for the entire back unless you are working on a utility chisel. For better work, the entire back should be flat. The whole back needn't be highly be highly polished, but it should be flat.

The Lie-Nielsen youtube chisel has some excellent chisel sharpening videos. They don't use Tormek, but the theory is the same.

The handbook doesn't cover bevel angles for different kinds of steel in chisels. O1, or high carbon steel, the traditional tool steel, is customarily ground to 25 degrees. A2 is ground to 30 degrees.

This is already too long, so I will refer you to the camber topic I started for cambering plane blades. I feel the video did not include cambering for different functions.

You are off to a good start. Keep growing and keep posting!

Ken

[Rob]

My turkey baster is European made :-)