LED light battery situation

[Ken S]

I have two magnetic LED lights for my Tormek. (The second arrived yesterday.) Both appear to be very well machined and are from very reliable businesses. They also look identical. The first one is a terrific light for the Tormek. The magnet works very well and the bright, focused light is a joy to use.

The only problem is that the generally available batteries are just a little too large for clearance. The battery chamber fits too tightly in the cylinder and cannot be removed. The light is a one battery marvel.

Has anyone found slightly thinner batteries (AA) which would work better?

A second option might be drilling a hole in the other end to use sonething like a hex wrench to push the battery chamber out if the cylinder.

Any ideas? These lights work great, if they work.

Thanks,

Ken

[Hatchcanyon]

Ken,

I would try to give these lamps back. Looks like a terrible manufacturing problem.

Batteries are standardized worldwide. AA is always AA. This includes size. and tolerances of the size. If the battery does not fit well, the next one will sure fail too. Never had such a problem in decades

But you might try if the problem lies within the battery (too thick!). Take another brand and try again. There are thinner Batteries, the AAA type but these are definitely too slim.

Me too use LED for the Tomek bit in a light fixture like for fluorescent lamps.  Length is approximately 600 mm. This is mounted on the wall above the machine and provides bright shadowless light.

Rolf

[Ken S]

Rolf,

You are correct. There is a manufacturing problem. I will return the light I just purchased. The seller, Lee Valley, is very reputable. They even pay for return shipping. I sent them an email explaining the situation. I have no doubt they will check into and correct the situation.

I have had the first one for a while. It was a gift. I plan to look into drilling a small in the other side. I may be able to use an Allen wrench or piece of coat hanger wire to push the battery chamber out. That is not an ideal correction, but it might be workable. The light does work very well (with good batteries )

Thanks for your thoughts.

Ken

[jeffs55]

Has anyone found slightly thinner batteries (AA) which would work better?

I have had the same problem with AAA batteries not being uniform in size. You need to let the forum know what you have that works; if any, we can then measure any AA we have and tell you what not to use.

[jeffs55]

Ken,
Batteries are standardized worldwide. AA is always AA. This includes size. and tolerances of the size. If the battery does not fit well, the next one will sure fail too. Never had such a problem in decades
Rolf

Not really, I have some rechargables that will not fit where your common Eveready, Duracell or whatever will fit.

[grepper]

Other than for smoke detectors, I won't use anything that takes AA or AAA batteries that won't take rechargeable batteries anymore.  I bought a bunch of them and have not had to purchase any more batteries for years.  Eneloop and Imedion are great AA/AAA LSD Ni-MH batteries!  I have not had a problem with them fitting in anything yet.

Get yourself a MAHA MH-C9000 charger and you're good to go. 

[Ken S]

Thanks for the replies! This is an example  of the value of this forum. One discouraged member posts a warning that an otherwise very functional light will not work because of a design flaw.  Several members come to the rescue with good suggestions to work around the problem.

I was finally able to remove the battery chamber using a small Allen wrench as a lever and then Channelock pliers used very gently.

I made some preliminary measurements of the batteries I happen to have on hand. They range from 13.43mm or .551" for Energizer rechargeable 1400mAh to 14.23mm or .563 for the Duracell rechargeable 2450mAh. Energizer Alkaline measures 14.15mm or .558".

There was some variation in readings depending on where the measurements were made. I consider these measurements preliminary rather than definitive. The important measurement is that all three are too large to fit into the cylinder except with too much friction to be easily removed.

Please measure your batteries and post the  results.

These are good lights, if we can find batteries sized right for them. I still consider the designed flawed if it will not work with everyday batteries.

Grepper, you make a good point about using good rechargeables. I looked up the charger you recommend on AmazonIt looks like it has some good features including variable charging time. Would you please post your thoughts on it. Also, could you post the diameters of the batteries you recommend.

For many years I have had a hobby interest in machine shop measurement. Standardization, precise measurement, and interchangeable parts have given us our present standard of living. It seems unfortunate to me that the batteryindustry doesnot have tighter standards.

Ken

[grepper]

Ken, It doesn't look like Imedion batteries are going to help with a smaller diameter battery:

AA Dimensions (Lmm x Wmm)

Duracell  2100 mAh   50.18 x 14.06  (Alkaline)
Imedion  2100 mAh   50.35 x 14.30
Imedion  2400 mAh   50.29 x 14.35

AAA Dimensions (Lmm x Wmm)

Eneloop    800 mAh   44.30 x 10.30

I take it the battery box is square?  Could you use a milling machine or rotary tool like a Dremel to remove a little material from the inner sides of the box?  It probably would require minimal material removal to make a difference.

Can you post a link to or image of the light?

The MH-C9000 has been a great charger for NiMH batteries.  I've had it for years and it's still going strong.

It has various modes: charge, refresh-analyze, dischare and cycle.  It defaults to charge mode.  To charge a battery: insert battery, press Enter, set the charge current, press Enter.  Simple.

You can select the charge current so you can fast or slow charge a battery.  For each slot you can select from 200 mA to 2A charge current.  Generally 50% or the rated capacity (0.5C) of the battery is a good general choice.  So for a 2400 mAh battery select 1200 mAh charge current.

Many chargers have a 2A max charge current that is divided between all of the cells.  So if you stick in 4 batteries, they may only charge @ 500 mAh and take forever to charge.  Or when charging AAA batteries make you charge 2 at a time in specific slots, say, slot #1 and slot #3 so as not to cook the batteries.  How ridiculous is that?

The charge current is up to you.  You could for instance stick in a 800 mAh AAA and charge it at 2A if you wanted to.  This would no doubt fry the battery and probably start a fire, but at least it's under your control.

I noticed some folks whined on Amazon that it was too complicated.  I suspect these folks also use dull knives.

Other modes such as refresh/analyze will charge, wait for the battery chemistry to settle down, discharge, wait for the battery chemistry to settle down, and then charge, displaying the final capacity of the battery upon completion.  Of course the charge/discharge current is user selectable.  For the most complete refresh, it is best to select a slow 0.25C charge/discharge rate.  If you do this once a year or every couple of years it will keep batteries in top shape and can revive cells that other charges won't charge.

I've been completely satisfied with the charger and if it dies I will purchase another without hesitation.

[Ken S]

Great post. Thanks, Grepper. I will putthe charger on my wish list.

I have a large collection of ideas which don't quite work. My latest was to see if, by chance, the plastic of the battery chamber might be the culprit. No such luck.

From what I have learned, battery engineers keep adding more capacity in just a little more space. I think what I may need are the old Union Carbide "neverready" batteries without the wonders of today's overstuffed technology. I am not a Luddite; I just want my light to work.

Incidentally, I contacted tech support of two battery manufacturers. One replied, "within industry standards". (13.5 to 14.5mm) The other tech support didn't know.

I tried an inexpensive drug store brand of alkalines. (no luck) (not the store a member recommended)
I will try the other drug store. I will try the inexpensive batteries at my local Harbor Freight and see what the local Batteries Plus might have. I suspect their batteries are overteched and overstuffed.

The search continues. If it is successful, the magnetic LED lights work very well with the T7 and SuperGrinds. I believe most Super Grind owners might benefit from better light.

Ken

[Jan]

Based on Einstein famous formulae E = m.c² a fully charged battery should weight slightly more than a discharged battery of the same temperature. 

Jan

[Ken S]

That's good news for backpacking photographers. The pack will weigh less on the return trip....

Ken

[Jan]

Ken,

you are correct, it is really true. 
But on the other hand the camera memory with digital images is slightly heavier than an empty memory. 

Jan

[Ken S]

Jan,

We just can't catch a break! 

Ken

[Ken S]

We should note one thing about the magnetic LED light; unlike the new T8 water trough which is not backwards compatable, the magnetic LED light works only with the T7 and SuperGrind. It will not work with the zinc tops of the T4 or T8. It should be noted that Tormek has never sold lights. These are independent third party items which happen to work very well with the Tormek.

Ken

[SharpenADullWitt]

We should note one thing about the magnetic LED light; unlike the new T8 water trough which is not backwards compatable, the magnetic LED light works only with the T7 and SuperGrind. It will not work with the zinc tops of the T4 or T8. It should be noted that Tormek has never sold lights. These are independent third party items which happen to work very well with the Tormek.

Ken

Between the fact they never sold them (seemed to me to be more of a gimmick, similar to the hat thing a few years ago), and the fact that I have had too much mixed luck with "cheap" lights that use those three in one battery packs, I will pass on that style of light..
I picked up my preferred light at a garage sale a few years back (fixed a bad connection) and have since picked up another one.  My preference is those lighted magnifying lamps.  If I need something as a backlight, I carry a Microstream flashlight in my pocket, daily for all kinds of uses.
Tormek has had some giveaways/bonuses over the years I looked at them.  To me the good ones were:
Free threaded universal support upgrade (back when I first looked at them, think around 2004)
Lifetime stone replacement (don't remember when or who)
Rotating base. (couple years? back, tempted me to get a second one.  Later bought with a bunch of OT)

The Tormek cover/hat/light things were less useful, IMHO.  (My brain laughingly thinks of this as "what would the engineers like as a giveaway, verses what would the marketing dept. like as a giveaway?)

Best bet, may be just to improve the all around lighting in the general use location.