SE-77 first thoughts

[Ken S]

Last week Stig travelled from Sweden to Ohio to train me on the new SE-77 Square Edge Jig. Seeing Stig is always a joy; his excitement about the Tormek is contagious. The trip also gave him a chance to see Affinity Tool, the US importer and the major dealers.

In an interview Stig was asked what kinds of tools he sharpens. He responded. "knives.....and chisels." I am just the opposite. Chisels, planes and I go back over five decades. Knives are fairly recent, mostly a result of meeting Steve. For me, the Tormek and SE-76 jig were a welcome relief from oil and water stones and dry grinders, however getting squarely ground edges required some finesse. Adding camber (a slightly convex edge) with plane blades never seemed very precise and was tedious.

The new SE-77 Square Edge Jig changes all of that. The two smaller knobs allow quick and easy squareness adjustment. No longer is it necessary to loosen, adjust and retighten the chisel for perfect dquareness. Camber can be precisely controlled. The SE-77 brings the same level of versatility, precision and repeatability to chisels and plane blades that the SVD-186 brings to gouges. This new jig should appeal to fastidious woodworkers who demand uniform plane blade edges and very square chisels.

The new design also makes it possible to sharpen shorter spokeshave blades with the SE-77.

Holding just the SE-77 in my hands, I found it difficult to understand how the adjustments worked. When I mounted the jig on a universal support, the mechanism made sense.

The jig is made of zink, a real improvement over the aluminum of the older jigs. Zink can be precisely machined and it has a more solid feel.

The knob away from the registration fence is movable from full width to approximately 30 mm or justover an inch. This makes accurate tightening easier with narrower blades. Securing the blades in place is very solid.

To be very critical, I did note that the underside edges of the threaded rings for the adjustment knobs are a bit rough. These are out of the way, and not where they might catch a finger. I actually enjoy putting a little sweat equity into tools, so this doesn't bother me. A quick minute with a small file and all is well.

Just my opinion, I believe this jig could benefit from an equivalent TTS-100 as designed by the forum. While the Anglemaster works very well with longer flat blades like chisels and plane blades, a specially designed TTS-100 like tool would make set up quicker and more accurately repeatable.

From the forum standpoint, Tormek has kindly left us some enjoyable work. The two adjustment knobs, like micrometer screws, are capable of very precise adjustment. Except for a neutral mark, Tormek has not calibrated them. For those of us willing to spend some calibration time, some basic tests could easily be done to determine, for example, how many knob turns would be necessary for a .002" camber for a smooth plane; how many turns would be necessary for a .006" camber for a jointer plane and how much camber is added with the knobs fully backed out. This would add the repeatablilty of the jouge jigs to square edge work. This is a fertile area for the technically inclined on the forum.

With the adjustment knobs in neutral, the jig seems as fast to use as the earlier jigs. As with many Tormek jigs, it offers the versatility of using it for basic chisel and plane blade sharpening or adding finesse. While the earlier square edge jigs remain as good as ever, "good" just got a whole lot better with the new jig. I always ask two questions with new Tormek products: 1) For a new buyer, is the new product substantially better than the older product? 2) For those Tormek users already using the older product, is investing in the new product worthwhile? In my opinion, the answer to both questions is an unhesitating YES.

Stay tuned.

Ken

[brettgrant99]

Thanks for the update.  I believe that you mean zinc instead of zink.  I could go on about zinc alloys, but won't.  I am assuming that the finish of the jig is much better than the past, and that is what impressed you.

I was a locksmith in a former life, and zinc alloys are used extensively in those products.  They tend to be quite brittle, but I know that this can be overcome by the makeup of the alloy.  I never really though much about the old jigs, how do you know that they were made out of a aluminum?  Something that you read, were told, or assumed?  I know that I don't know, and I always thought of them as zinc alloy.  Perhaps a zinc aluminum alloy?  It doesn't really matter.  I am obsessing about something that I haven't even seen.  Just ignore my ranting.

I am glad that you are impressed with it.  Everything sounds good with it.  I may have missed it, do we know the price point for it yet?  And when it may be available?  Or did you get a preproduction version?

[Herman Trivilino]

I was a locksmith in a former life, and zinc alloys are used extensively in those products.

The Tormek T3 was upgraded to the T4 recently and one of the improvements was a zinc mounting for the universal support.

I never really though much about the old jigs, how do you know that they were made out of a aluminum?  Something that you read, were told, or assumed?  I know that I don't know, and I always thought of them as zinc alloy.  Perhaps a zinc aluminum alloy?

Perhaps. I also doubt that they are pure aluminum, but like you I don't know for sure.

[SharpenADullWitt]

Love to see a comparison video.

[Ken S]

Brett, zink is what zinc becomes after almost fifty years away from school. Let's go with zinc.

I am no metallurgist. I am not certain about the alloys old or new. The new jigs are heavier and the finish is better.

My SE-77 is the production model. They should be available soon. I am not certain about price point. I believe the price will be close to the price of the older jig. Although I did not purchase this jig, in the past I have purchased two Tormeks, almost all of the jigs and accessories, and extras of some at market price. I would certainly have purchased the new SE-77.

Upgrading from the all plastic housing of the T3 to the plastic housing with the zinc upper portion of the T4 made the T4 a much more capable machine. It eliminated the overheating problem. The "motor problem" was actually caused by internal heat not being disapated in the T3. The zinc top acts as a radiator

Ken

[Jan]

Zink is the German name for zinc derived form "zincum" or "zinken" coined by medieval German alchemist Paracelsus. 

A bar of zinc, when bent, produces a specific sound described as screaming. It is caused by the crystal twinning in the metal and demonstrated in crystallography lessons.

Jan

P.S.: Zinc is also the primary metal used in American one cent coins. The zinc core is coated with a copper to give the impression of a copper coin.   

[brettgrant99]

Thanks for the clarification.

Brett

Brett, zink is what zinc becomes after almost fifty years away from school. Let's go with zinc.

I am no metallurgist. I am not certain about the alloys old or new. The new jigs are heavier and the finish is better.

My SE-77 is the production model. They should be available soon. I am not certain about price point. I believe the price will be close to the price of the older jig. Although I did not purchase this jig, in the past I have purchased two Tormeks, almost all of the jigs and accessories, and extras of some at market price. I would certainly have purchased the new SE-77.

Upgrading from the all plastic housing of the T3 to the plastic housing with the zinc upper portion of the T4 made the T4 a much more capable machine. It eliminated the overheating problem. The "motor problem" was actually caused by internal heat not being disapated in the T3. The zinc top acts as a radiator

Ken

[Ken S]

I finally realized my error. I must have shifted into Swedish. The English word "zinc" is "zink" in Swedish.

Ken

[Herman Trivilino]

My SE-77 is the production model. They should be available soon. I am not certain about price point.

Advanced Machinery is currently accepting pre-orders for $69.95 US. Shipping in early June.

26 April is the date stamp on the announcement email messages I received, one from Tormek AB, one from Advanced Machinery.

[Ken S]

Thanks, Herman. Incidentally, the Advanced Machinery website also lists the older SE-76 for $60. For anyone contemplating the purchase of a square edge jig, the SE-77 is the no brainer choice, even if one needs to wait.

Ken

[Ken S]

PS 
I discovered  one of the announcements from Tormek AB in my spam (junk) file. I hope my effort to change that setting was successful and will more carefully monitor spam in the future.

Ken

[Herman Trivilino]

I still have and use the older SVH-60 Straight Edge jig. It takes experience and skill to get a square end on a chisel or plane iron. For the work I do, the ends are square enough for me.

[Ken S]

Your point is well taken, Herman. You have skill and experience with the Tormek and, I am sure, with sharpening in general.You can make a very keen edge as square as you need. You have also developed a realistic sense of how square you need your chisels to be for the task at hand.

Many newer users have not developed that skill. You worked in the age of the framing hammer. Younger people today live in the edge of the nail gun. I remember one new user who was ready "to bin" (discard) his Tormek because his first day results were not the perfection he expected. I don't recall further posts from him. Our megabit age requires very quick results. I believe the new jig can help produce those results more quickly. That level of perfection may not be necessary or practical, however, people want it.

I have a couple SVH-60 jigs, and would be quite happy using them if they were still the state of the art. I feel the new SE-77 has pushed back the frontier of the state of the art, especially for plane blades. Some of our new users will achieve a high level of skill. Some of them will seem naturally talented. Some will advance less quickly. Any improvement in the Tormek or its jigs which promotes this level of proficiency is, in my opinion, desirable.

Ken

[Stickan]

Hi,
Just to clarify regarding material of the jigs and parts on machines. In the past we always used Aluminium and some jigs are still made of Aluminium. The last years we have been using Zinc as it gives us better tolerances among other benefits. The first Zinc jig was the drill-bit holder on the DBS-22. Then we changed the SWM-45 , followed by the top of the T-4, SVS-38, SVD-186 and now also on the SE-77. I don't know how many members on the forum has both versions on any of these but the difference is very noticeable, both in the way they look, weight and performance.
Best,
Stig

[Jan]

Thank you Stig for the overview of jigs where zinc material is used. 

You are correct, the increase of weight is very noticeable. The density of zinc is circa 7.1 g/cm³ while the density of aluminium is only circa 2.7 g/cm³.

Jan