Magnifier

[AndrewLee]

All advice above is duly noted. I've watched Alan's video again and reread the instruction manual. In my haste I've skipped a few steps in the middle of the drill bit sharpening process. I'll have to further redouble my efforts. (I'm young and excitement and enthusiasm often makes me ignorant and impatient).

However, I still am not satisfied with the loupe provided. Maybe it's because I tried to align a 3mm drill bit and maybe that's too small for the magnifier.

New question now then guys: any suggestions for a cheap but passable head mounted loupe? The prices range from £3 off Amazon to £100 plus for professional jewellers loupes.. Obviously I only want it to help me with aligning the drill bit so something cheap would be good but I don't want to buy one so cheap it wouldnt do the job at hand either 

[Ken S]

Andrew,

Your experience with the drill bit magnifier reminds me of my early struggle with my 4x5 view camera. In case you are not familiar with a view camera, it is the large camera with viewing and focusing beneath a black cloth. It has a definite learning curve. I wanted one for years and when I finally purchased one I could not see using it. I was frustrated and discouraged. I persisted and eventually my eyes became accostumed to the camera. Once you get over the learning curve it is an incredible camera and spoils you for any other camera. It is a real joy to use and extremely versatile.

I suggest you set the 3 mm bit aside. I think it is probably the most difficult size to sharpen. If you need a sharp bit immediately, buy another one. Small bits are cheap.

Pick out some bits in the ten to twelve millimeter range. You can easily see these without the magnifier. Break down the learning process into bite sized pieces. When you can consistently sharpen bits of this size perfectly and efficiently, gradually work down, millimeter by millimeter. Try introducing the magnifier at around eight millimeter. When your eye becomes accostumed to the magnifier at that size, keep moving gradually smaller.

You need to tune your eye and your thinking. I would leave the bit in the jig near bright light. Pick it up and look through the magnifier several times a day. Good daylight is a starting point. Your eyes should adapt.

Start with the easiest size to sharpen. Gain mastery of the skills and sneak up on the 3mm bit. Let us know how you are progressing.

Ken

[AndrewLee]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/k2moysq5g4vv9kv/IMG_20160609_090400669.jpg?dl=0

[AndrewLee]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4hieozu62u6mzaq/IMG_20160609_094700787.jpg?dl=0

Before and after pics of a 10mm drill bit ive attempted to grind. Does it look correctly done?

I tried drilling through some pine and it came out very clearly, no problems drilling through at all so I'm happy with it at the moment

[Ken S]

Very good work, Andrew. Your primary facets line up exactly. You are ninety five percent of the there. Your primary facets should be parallel out to the edges.

I hope to have some quiet shop time next Monday. I will set up ny DBS-22 and sharpen a few bits. My gut feeling is that grinding a bit more on the primary facets might help make them parallel. I have not used the drill bit jig frequently enough for instant recall. Some study and experimenting is in order.

Keep up the good work. (and maybe don't wait quite so long to resharpen

Ken

[AndrewLee]

Cheers Ken, I'll have to upload a pic of a perfectly done drill bit as and when that happens!

Andrew

[RichColvin]

Andrew,

One of the great things that I like about this jig's manual is that it shows how doing it wrongly looks.  On page 14 (of the English version, at least), it shows how the drill being not aligned correctly can produce different primary facets.  (Here's a link to the online version of it ==> http://tormek.com/international/en/grinding-jigs/dbs-22-drill-bit-sharpening-attachment/.)

Yours, it seems, was rotated clockwise.

Don't get discouraged :  I have also done the same thing more times that I wish to remember.  Particularly when I had a drill which I or someone else had misused, and it required quite a bit of grinding to get it back into shape. 

The good news is that it isn't hard to fix.  If you are using it for wood, I would try for more evenly shaped primary facets, as the periphery of the bit is where more cutting happens than at the centre.

Kind regards,
Rich

[AndrewLee]

Hey there Rich,

Thanks for pointing that out for me. Day if I wanted to rectify this mistake? If my error was too clockwise as stated, would I twist it back counterclockwise to fix it?

Hmm Im sure I had it parallel to the horizontal markings too.. 

[Ken S]

Rich, I'm glad we brought you along! Andrew, listen to this guy. I've seen his shop; he knows his stuff.

Ken

[RichColvin]

Andrew,

Indeed, you do rotate it anti-clockwise (or counter clockwise).  Should do the job.

Kind regards,
Rich

P.S., thank you Ken for the kind words.

[Ken S]

Rich,

You're welcome. For a while it seemed I might have been the only posting member of the forum with a DBS-22 drill bit jig. It seems the jigs are now more plentiful. I hope other members will post!

Ken

[AndrewLee]

Cheers Rich, I'll have to give that a try and post the results

As a point of interest, how long have you two been woodworking for? I'm 30 and been at it for only a few years. I'm hoping woodworking with become a lifelong passion for me. That's my mentality when I bought the dbs22 -  that this will last me a lifetime and beyond!

Interestingly, I couldn't resist and had another go with a 3mm bit. The result was sketchy, one side seemed ground more than the other side. I think it's because I haven't used the dresser to turn the wheel into a more gentler grit.

However, it still drilled scarily well, even more so than my 10mm "properly grounded" bit. Maybe it's because of how small the bit is by nature that it'll break through wood fibres alot easier than bigger bits. Not perfect,  but ideal for me right now, I'm using it to drill pilot holes for cladding for a shed I'm building. A super sharp bit will speed the process up considerably!


This forum really needs an off topic area for other points of discussion. Only corresponded with you Ken and Rich but already I'm seeing that there's lots of guys here that have alot of advice to offer, something a newcomer like me appreciates! Woodworking feels like a very lonely hobby for me anyway, toiling away hours in the garage and it's nice to talk to like minded people.


Also, are we allowed to discuss other products apart from tormek on here? I have the dowel max jig and can't praise it enough, the main reason I got the dbs22 is so I can regrind the dowel max's drill bit to further enhance its performance. I'm too afraid to at the moment until I reground lots of other bits and gain that confidence and experience!

[Ken S]

Andrew,

I agree; we could use a separate area for more general topics. I think of handtool woodworkingkk as fulfilling that function, sort of. As moderator, I am very loose on catagories.

As far as mentioning other products, the generally followed guidelines are that we prefer not to make too much mention of products which are in direct competition with Tormek. Tormek is regarded as the premier wet grinder in quality, engineering, innovation and price. I am not comfortable with product bashing. While some of the information may benefit users of competitive sysrems, this forum is primarily oriented toward Tormek users.

That stated, My personal feeling is that anything which assists us in using the Tormek is welcome for discussion. If you read my posts, you will know that I use and recommend the Edgeonup knife edge testers. They give us a more objective way to test and share knife edge sharpness. Please note that Tormek does not manufacture or sell any edge testers. Therefore, these products compliment the Tormek system without competing with it.

I have also promoted Steve Bottorff's Sharpening School DVD and Robin Bsiley's oversized universal support bar. I have found both very useful and neither competes with Tormek. In the case of Steve's DVD, I have asked Tormek for several years to produce more in depth training videos, with no success. (Tormek has done an outstanding video on turning tools. I recommend it highly. I wish they would do more.)

This forum is non commercial. I do not want it to become a market for those looking for cheap Tormek stuff or wanting to sell. Go to an online auction site for that. That, spam, and attacking posts will be deleted immediately.

We are a polite, helpful, self governing group.

For the record, Andrew, I am sixty six. My interest in woodworking began in 1962 and has been sporadic ever since, competing with family, earning a living, photography and an interest in machine tool and measuring technology. What got me started with the Tormek was the pain in my hands from preparing some new chisels for a handcut dovetails class. The majority of my woodworking knowledge is from study.

Ken

[AndrewLee]

There's just so many things people can discuss about, not just about tormek but woodworking in general lol

One thing I've wondered is the whole hand tool vs machines debate. Ken, you teach dovetails, but what makes it so good compared to having it done with machines? Being inexperienced I'm all for things which aid me in making things easier.


https://www.dropbox.com/s/x7mo41kblwj46gn/IMG_20160610_230152180.jpg?dl=0

It's late, I climbed out of the bed and into the garage to regrinding my drill bit - it was really bugging me! Boy am I happy that I have done so, thing is near perfect after listening to Rich's advice. Damn thing is now the best bit in my arsenal despite being a cheap Chinese bit. I am so happy lol


Any point rummaging through car boot sales for old drill bits and gouges and chisels? Anyone know what's good brands to keep a discreet eye out for? I'm trying to avoid Chinese steel of possible.

Andrew

[Ken S]

Andrew,

You now have a properly sharpened bit. Congratulations!

Having been thirty once and experiencing many of the frustrations you are now, I will be so bold as to offer some advice.  For those readers who have read my posts over the years, this may sound repetitious. That is intentional.

Having collected too much unnecessary stuff over the years, my advice for you is to accumulate knowledge and skill, plus the few good tools you need. From your comment about the cost of the SVD-186 in pounds sterling, I assume you are probably located in the UK. I would look for solid instruction. Check out Robin Bailey for sharpening, Glenn Lucas for turning or David Charlesworth for fine woodworking. Early exposure to a master will give you a hyper leap, much more than purchasinog tools. Look on the tormek website for a Tormek friends video featuring Glenn Lucas.

Concentrate your focus. You don't have the resources, financial, time, or mental to go off in too many directions at once; none of us do. Pick an area, sharpening, turning, woodwork, whatever. Focus on that until you are proficient. At that point you can expand your focus in an orderly manner.

Do not try to substitute forums, this one or any other, for a solid teacher. Try to realize the real areas of any forum. This forum has a primary focus of using the Tormek. Other areas, such as hand tool woodworking are included, but really outside the primary focus. For forums with this focus, you might check lumberjocks or sawmillcreek. Among forums for Tormek, I modestly think we are the best. Among other things, the bulk of us actually own and use Tormeks.

Invest in yourself first. Learn the craft.

Ken