Removing rusty shaft from grindstone

[mark.horowitz@comcast.net]

I've just bought a used T2000 and am trying to replace the shaft which is rusted to the wheel. I've got the whole shaft and wheel out of the machine with the nut and outside washer off. I've read everything on the forum. I've put it in a vise with the shaft sticking down and banged on the shaft with a hammer. No movement. There is a washer on the backside of the stone that looks like it has rusted to the shaft, or is it meant to be integral? Does the shaft just go straight through the stone, or is there something else holding it? I'd rather not have to buy a new stone since this one is good. Any other advice? Heating shaft?

Thanks for any help.

[Ken S]

Welcome to the forum, Mark.  Herman is our resident rusted shaft expert.  I haven't had the problem (my shaft is a newer stainless steel model.)

I have wondered if applying radial pressure on the shaft might be better than trying to pound it out.  With a pipe wrench or something similar on the shaft, try gradually trying to turn the shaft.  Easy does it.

Hopefully Herman or the moderator will chime it.

Good luck.

Ken

[grepper]

Just some ideas:

Along Ken's idea, could you put an impact driver on the nut?

Hey Mr. Stig, would penetrating oil hurt the stone?  Exactly how is the hub attached to the stone?  Just glue?  Is the hub OD ribbed or otherwise grips the stone?

[jeffs55]

Pipe wrench on the shaft sounds good and put the wrench in a vise and turn the wheel. If the wrench will not hold, could you grind two flats on the shaft and use a wrench to turn it. You might try heating the shaft near the hub and then quenching in water. Maybe it would expand the shaft just a tad and the sudden cool down would break the bond created by the rust. That is a little extreme though. Holding the shaft with a wrench and using a hammer drill or impact driver sounds pretty good.

[Mike Fairleigh]

...could you grind two flats on the shaft and use a wrench to turn it...

I like that idea.  You could also chuck the shaft into a vise and put a large strap wrench around the wheel.  That would give lots of leverage.  I think we're all assuming that the shaft is going to be ruined with any of these ideas and that you'll be upgrading to the stainless shaft so this doesn't happen again. 

[Stickan]

Hi,
dont use force!
Put some WD-40/5-56 on both sides, let in work over night. Give the shaft a light knock with a plastic hammer. Put more WD-40/5-56 on and do the same thing over again. It will work after a couple times. If its bad it can take some days, but normally it works over night.
Patience is the key :-)

Stig

[Ken S]

Good idea, Stig.  Gentler is safer.

Ken

[mark.horowitz@comcast.net]

Thank you guys. I will try some of your ideas, but I still have this question:

How is the wheel held to the shaft? Does it just slide straight through and held by pressure between the two large washers and nut?

I got the nut off with an impact wrench which stripped the nut but that's ok since I am replacing the shaft. I but WD 40 between shaft and stone and hit with hammer. No budge. I left sitting with WD-40 overnite and will now go see if I can tap it out. I'll go with the gentle idea until I get really frustrated, as I'd like to save the wheel.

[SharpenADullWitt]

How is the wheel held to the shaft? Does it just slide straight through and held by pressure between the two large washers and nut?

I got the nut off with an impact wrench which stripped the nut but that's ok since I am replacing the shaft. I but WD 40 between shaft and stone and hit with hammer. No budge. I left sitting with WD-40 overnite and will now go see if I can tap it out. I'll go with the gentle idea until I get really frustrated, as I'd like to save the wheel.

That is how it is held.  The late, prior owner of mine, chipped his wheel, fighting to get it off the shaft. (when I got it, it had a brand new wheel and the chipped one)  Herm has fought his, but you have probably read his posts.  My only other thought, since your replacing the shaft, is drill a hole in something flat, for the stone to sit on and the shaft to go through, then bolt some kind of weight to the other side, to pull with gravity, while sitting with WD40, or some kind of penetrate on the stone end.

[Mike Fairleigh]

Also, something like Liquid Wrench, PB Blaster, or Kroil may help more, or more quickly, than WD40.

[grepper]

Yea, as long as the products other than WD-40 don't have ingredients that could mess with the adhesives in the wheel.  I have no clue, but maybe Stig recommended WD-40 specifically for a reason?

Sometimes penetrating oil can take days to work.  One time I soaked a very rusty pair of locking pliers in penetrating oil for 5 days before they finally loosened up.  But eventually they did.

[Herman Trivilino]

There is a washer on the backside of the stone that looks like it has rusted to the shaft, or is it meant to be integral?

It's not integral. It's likely rusted to both the shaft and the grindstone.

Does the shaft just go straight through the stone, or is there something else holding it?

It just slides through, but it's likely rusted. I would take Stig's advice and keep applying a penetrating oil.

This is pure conjecture, but I wonder if it might be helpful to wrap the grindstone with a band clamp to keep it from breaking apart as you try to free the main shaft. By the way, what's the diameter of the grindstone? I'm just curious as it indicates its value as well as the machine's usage.

[mark.horowitz@comcast.net]

OK sportsfans, another episode in "Mark's Believe it or Not"
I used Liquid Wrench and WD-40 at different times and let soak for two nights. I tapped on the shaft but it didn't budge. I put the wheel in the vise and used a pipe wrench on the long side of the shaft. The shaft broke off at the wheel clean at the wheel without moving in the wheel at all! The wheel is still intact so I am soaking what remains of the shaft in Liquid Wrench overnight again. The Liquid Wrench seems to be soaking into the stone around the shaft. If it doesn't come out with a few strong taps tomorrow, I will start trying to drill out the shaft without enlarging the hole unless anyone has other suggestions.

BTW, the stone is now 223 mm diameter. I think it's still worth trying to save it, don't you?

Thanks for all of your suggestions. Clearly, designing a new shaft was a great idea for Tormek.

[jeffs55]

Place the stone on a flat surface and using progressively larger drill bits, drill into the shaft and make a large hole. Use the unbroken end so it will be flat and you can find the center easier. If you can center the first hole, you have it licked. at some point the drilled hole will become so large that you can remove it. You may have to use a tap to turn into it and thread it. Simply "strip" out the hole you have made with the tap and remove the destroyed shaft. Obviously you will have to come very close to the shaft diameter to make it thin enough to be able to remove it.

[Lillis]

I would try to use threds to puch the stone out. Use lots of washers or a pipe between the knut and the stone and puch it out. You will get so much force with a wrench.
Used this method on hydralic servosterings on boats, you get more force than with a sledgehammer.

Dont know exacly how it looks, but its worth a try. Its easier to make new threds than drilling a hole.