Reflections on Tormek Use in a Multi-User Commercial Setting

[Travis G]

Hi guys,

I just wanted to give some information back to a very helpful community after implementing the Tormek in 15 of our knife stores for the past 1.5 years. We made the switch from Catra Sharp 2000 machines to Tormek T-7s after careful consideration and testing to ensure that this was the right tool for our uses.

Our goals:
- versatility in sharpening knives of varying shapes, sizes, and edge angles
- consistency in results between different stores and sharpening personnel
- ease of use and training on the machine
- economic viability: low cost of operation
- reasonable "speed/edge quality" ratio

The T-7 came out as the winner in all categories. I've been the one responsible for training staff in sharpening since the implementation of the Tormek and it's impressive how quickly we've been able to get staff on board with the machine. Although some of you may cringe to think that we have folks other than meticulous craftsmen using these machines, I've found that with a few tips and tricks, we can get most staff producing excellent edges after a day of training. It obviously helps that they have a bit of a knowledge base on knives and sharpening to begin with, but many of these folks have not come from a sharpening background, yet they catch on quite quickly.

Simply put, we love the Tormek for many reasons. It's quiet (unless you're sharpening scissors), leaves a fantastic edge, and is a major conversation starter in our stores (we have it out "on the floor" for customers to see us sharpen). It has increased the quality of our sharpening service in profound ways, plus it has served to educate our staff on better understanding the intricacies of knife edges.

Overall, I have found the machine extremely well-designed and the more I use it, the more I realize how much thought has gone into the making of this unit.

Here are a few bits of information that may help somebody along the way:

- stone life: we average between 6-10 months per stone in each store. This varies depending on how many sharpenings each store gets and whether or not they sharpen scissors (this dramatically decreases the lifespan of a stone). We have switched to using the SB-250 on all our machines. Although our methodology is in no way scientific, we have seen that the SB-250 provides enough increased longevity to justify the higher cost.

- honing wheel life: the only honing wheels we've had to replace were either over-oiled at the beginning of their use or gouged due to staff trying to lead the edge into the leather rather than stropping (yes, it happens unfortunately). Although nothing lasts indefinitely, I honestly see these honing wheels continuing for many years.

- slipping driveshaft: every so often, the motor driveshaft will slip on the rubber wheel. We generally use an abrasive to roughen the rubber wheel and driveshaft to regain that bite. So far it's worked well.

- NVR switch: in two of our stores that have high-speed grinders set up in close proximity, we've had the NVR switch fail due to a buildup of steel dust within the housing. We've been able to fix the NVR switches through disassembly and cleaning. We've lessened the impact of the proximity by using a cover over the Tormek when the grinder is in use.

- WM-200 wear: the plastic bits on the Anglemaster do wear out, especially if folks slide the WM-200 along the stone to get it to contact the blade properly. We probably go through a set of plastics once a year in each store. We've been able to get replacement plastics from our local vendor. I don't know if this is the case for other folks.

- SVM-45 and SVM-140 jigs stripping threads: the brass threaded inserts on the SVM-45 and SVM-140 do not hold up after extensive use (especially by folks who may not understand the qualities of threading in soft metals). We have ended up putting in Helicoils in each brass insert to extend the lifespan of the threads. So far, none of the Helicoil threads have failed, so this is something to consider for long-term usage.

I'm sure there's more information that I'm missing, but I figured I'd get this info out to hopefully contribute back to this community that has helped a lot. Although I'm not a prolific poster, I've often used the information shared here to better utilize the T-7.

Let me know if you have any questions or clarification on any of this. I'll share more if I can think of any points I've missed.

Thanks,

Travis
House of Knives

[Rob]

excellent post Travis and very nice to see the T7 being used in a commercial setting.  Interesting stats about wear and tear too.  I use the SB-250 also because of HSS turning tools but in the more general sense its clearly a much harder and therefore longer wearing stone.

[Herman Trivilino]

Do you find the SB more difficult to grade than the SG?  I would imagine that you spend most of your time with the grindstone in the "fine grade" mode, but have to roughen it up to get the cutting action back.

[jeffs55]

I am rather surprised that you are able to use the Tormek in a commercial setting. I mean that it is impossible to duplicate the edge grind on a thick blade knife without readjusting the knife in the rest. We all know that the current blade rests SVM-45 and SVM-140 do not allow the same grind pattern on two different sides of a thicker blade. Perhaps it is unnoticeable on a cheap paring knife but instantly spotted on a thicker bladed knife. I have to assume that your customers have not spotted this or do not care because the sharp edge they has them overwhelmed. Personally, I would see it. More power to you and continued success.

[Rob]

Do you find the SB more difficult to grade than the SG?  I would imagine that you spend most of your time with the grindstone in the "fine grade" mode, but have to roughen it up to get the cutting action back.

I was surprised myself to find the SB didn't require anything different to the original grindstone in terms of attention with the grader.  In fact, given its a harder material I never did fathom that??

[Travis G]

Hi guys,

Herman: Interestingly enough, we often keep the stone at the coarser setting rather than fine. It's not the ideal method, but we find that deburring and polishing on the strop after working the 220 grit actually still produces a strong, refined edge. We often deburr with a ceramic steel (or Spyderco Sharpmaker) between the 220 and the polishing wheel which produces even better results.

The time spent continuously grading between coarse and fine would be time (and thus cost) prohibitive, so we have looked for the most efficient way to produce the best edge.

So, to answer your question, I have insufficient data to give you an answer either way. I will say that truing does not seem to take any longer than with the original grindstone.

Jeff: Care is taken to measure and adjust the edge angle on either side of thicker knives. This was a concern at the beginning, but with a keen eye, we've been able to reduce the effects of uneven clamping. Obviously, many of us here on the forum would still pick up subtle inconsistencies in an instant, but you also have to remember that those who pick up those inconsistencies are also the ones who would probably be doing their own knife sharpening in the first place.

Our goal is still to produce the best possible edge within a reasonable timeframe. Most of our customers, as you mention, would not be looking this closely at the evenness of bevel, but we still take this into account in our sharpening methodology.

Thanks,

Travis

[Herman Trivilino]

Herman: Interestingly enough, we often keep the stone at the coarser setting rather than fine. It's not the ideal method, but we find that deburring and polishing on the strop after working the 220 grit actually still produces a strong, refined edge. We often deburr with a ceramic steel (or Spyderco Sharpmaker) between the 220 and the polishing wheel which produces even better results.

The rough edge left by the coarser grit gives the knife a "bite".  Some claim it makes it easier to do things like slice tomatoes.  Also, the grindstone leaves a hollow grind, so the very edge of the knife mates up nicely against the leather wheel.

[Ken S]

Travis,

Welcome to the forum.  Excellent and interesting post.

Please continue posting.

Ken

[jeffs55]

 but you also have to remember that those who pick up those inconsistencies are also the ones who would probably be doing their own knife sharpening in the first place.


I cannot argue with that!

[Ken S]

How much of the inconsistency is due to the limits of the Tormek, and how much is due to operator inexperience?

Ken

[Travis G]

Hi Ken,

I'd say that every double-beveled ("V-beveled") knife that gets clamped into the knife jig (long or short jigs: I have no experience with the newest jig for very small knives) has minor angle variances from side to side (anywhere from half a degree to a couple whole degrees variance). This is not as apparent on knives that have a very thin edge to begin with (thus a very small width of bevel), but on knives with a thicker bevel, it becomes obvious quite quickly.

So, on that end, it's a limitation of the Tormek knife clamp system. That said, operator experience can mitigate these issues if they're kept i mind during the sharpening process. It gets finicky in having to stop and measure the angle (or at the very least adjust it) every time you flip the jig over, but with a little practice, you get the flow down.

Travis

[Ken S]

Good and thoughtful post, Travis.  My knife sharpening is very limited.  (I'm mostly a woodworker.)

I will be curious to see how precise your bevels can be with much finicky attention to details.  Do keep us posted.

Ken

[jeffs55]

Hi Ken,

I'd say that every double-beveled ("V-beveled") knife that gets clamped into the knife jig (long or short jigs: I have no experience with the newest jig for very small knives) has minor angle variances from side to side (anywhere from half a degree to a couple whole degrees variance). This is not as apparent on knives that have a very thin edge to begin with (thus a very small width of bevel), but on knives with a thicker bevel, it becomes obvious quite quickly.

So, on that end, it's a limitation of the Tormek knife clamp system. That said, operator experience can mitigate these issues if they're kept i mind during the sharpening process. It gets finicky in having to stop and measure the angle (or at the very least adjust it) every time you flip the jig over, but with a little practice, you get the flow down.

Travis
That is exactly what I was referring to in my previous post when I wrote this, "Perhaps it is unnoticeable on a cheap paring knife but instantly spotted on a thicker bladed knife" but I thought that was well known as it has been mentioned before by someone else more learned than me.