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How to achieve less than 100 bess?

Started by jimon, May 09, 2024, 09:40:59 AM

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tgbto

Quote from: advjacky on August 04, 2026, 05:25:16 AMhi

Surface polishing and deburring can be done using 80-120 grit sanders

Yet another commercial post that only adds confusion. Those are becoming more frequent.

kwakster

Master Po sharpening service

BPalv

Quote from: tgbto on July 27, 2026, 10:52:59 AM
Quote from: BPalv on July 15, 2026, 02:26:30 PMIt will also show you when you've stropped too much.

Can you elaborate on this ? What are the effects of too much stropping ? Do you mean honing on the honing wheel ? What is your process ?

I have never experience such a thing as too much honing, but maybe it is because I haven't done enough testing...

Sorry for the late reply. 
I have a small shop and do not advertise. I rarely work all day and have time to experiment with different processes and techniques.
When I sharpen on the T-8, I hone on the leather wheel.  Currently I have two.  One is loaded with PA-70, the other with 1um (Tech Diamond Tools) Diamond paste.
I use the Bess every other pass or every pass once the burr fractures or starts to peel away. 
I believe successful burr removal techniques depend on the steel and temper and on my end, angle, pressure, speed of belt, grit size and number of passes.  My First Bess test after the burr starts to fracture will show an edge from 150 to 350, subsequent passes on the same media will result in progressively lower Bess numbers.  I would say, many mainstream steels show improvement till you get around 100.  Often this will be around 4 to 6 passes on the honing wheel with PA-70.  If I continue honing with the same media the numbers will stop improving and will often get worse.  Once that happens (8 to ? Passes) numbers will settle in higher than what I achieve with fewer passes. I believe that is the result of a micro rounded apex.
The best Bess numbers, for me, come shortly after the Burr starts to fall apart, 2 to 5 or 6 passes on the honing wheel.

Once I hit a wall with the PA-70 I switch to diamonds if I'm trying to hit a particular target.  Keeping in mind, the more I strop, the less aggressive the "teeth" will be.  There is a happy medium.

I find the fastest way to remove the burr is honing at +1.6 till the burr starts to fall apart (sometimes after 1 pass) Then lowering the angle to +.2 or.3, or exact angle for a couple finishing passes.

To sum things up, using the Bess as the burr starts to disolve will help preserve the "teeth" and prevent rounding the apex as evidenced by slightly higher Bess numbers on repeated passes.  The rounded apex may be user error by applying too much pressure or the wrong angle... maybe speed, not sure. Negitive and positive burrs require slightly different honing methods.
Bottom line: have a target Bess number in mind.  Don't fight it, stop when you hit it.

As the OP wanted to know how to hit sub 100 numbers, the above process works for me. Quality steel will help ensure your success and keep you from losing your mind. Once you see how long it takes to hit 50 vs. the length of time it stays that sharp, you will probably lose the desire to hit 50. One use will scoot that Bess number over or very close to 100.  It is doable and rewarding once you're there, but not practical for everyday use...IMHO

As mentioned before, Vadim stated there is a correlation between grit size and achievable Bess numbers.  I prefer CBN for consistent grit particles and results.  I do not have a diamond wheel.


John_B

This is almost exactly my process. I think I am at or below the 100 Bess mark based on tests outlined in Vadim's sharpening chart. I normally hone at +1.5°. I will try altering it to a lower number as you suggest after initial passes. Switching to the honing wheel with diamonds impregnated does help. I only bother with this step for my own knives. I normally stop with the PA-70 paste followed by stropping on leather.
Sharpen the knife blade
Hone edge until perfection
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BPalv

Quote from: John_B on Today at 06:59:40 PMThis is almost exactly my process. I think I am at or below the 100 Bess mark based on tests outlined in Vadim's sharpening chart. I normally hone at +1.5°. I will try altering it to a lower number as you suggest after initial passes. Switching to the honing wheel with diamonds impregnated does help. I only bother with this step for my own knives. I normally stop with the PA-70 paste followed by stropping on leather.
Our techniques do seem to be very similar...
When I use the angle setter I just guess at +1.6.  That number can vary,  depending on steel or temper.
I only use diamonds selectively.  High end knives or anything I'm trying to polish.

In honing, I believe the angle and pressure (coupled with your choice of stropping compound) is the key.  Strop too lightly, no progress, too heavy and you grind away the teeth and risk rounding the apex.  That angle comes into play as well.