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going to retire with that 10% off

KEN,

Overall, that is good advice directed to those of us just starting out. Naturally me included. I sense though, that you sense there's a "But" somewhere in this. Yes, there is.

I would not agree that this is a universal rule for all newbies. Remember some of us learn quicker and buy all the necessary gadgets upfront. I slowly did over the last two months or maybe somewhat a little more; when this Knife Sharpening bug hit me and hit me good.

The original Tormek Stone has its advantages so as their leather and composite wheels. But they are limiting.

I have all the Tormek diamond and other stones now on hand. now, diamond as we all know is the top of the line compared to its brother CBN.

What started my trip on CBN wheels was the fact of maybe saving the expenses of constantly having to add ACC to the water. So started my research on CBN that others have voiced, and have claimed that they can be run in normal tapwater. I like that very much. Having said this, I have ordered CBN from our well-known US distributor, a Swedish distributor, and of course, German. The US guy will not claim that they can be run in normal tapwater, although there have been videos where others have done youtube experiments with honerite and plain water and has found that the honerite works well with CBN wheels. Having said that, I prefer normal tap water as always an option.
So again can this happens somewhat quickly over the last 70 days or so since I started. you see some people newbies as I, as I'm sure there are many other newbies as well that somewhat speed up the process, and possibly learn a little quicker and like to get the more fine tuned equipment if you will.

I love CBN in plain water as I love diamond wheels. I love the diamond pastes. I like making my own chromium oxide paste that I've learned the process through knife grinders videos.

These additives for me, and I have to say for me. It's my opinion have way enhanced the sharpness of my knife edges. What has really exploded it to a higher plateau is kangaroo tails.

 I'd love some information on purchasing the hardware rather than me making it to make my own strops?

anyway, I don't want to write a storybook here. Your advice is good but I wouldn't say it's universal that's all Ken. My apologies upfront with somewhat disagreeing, but I'm sure you get the gist of this.

I truly want to thank you for your help behind the scenes to various information needs I have.

My next mission is awaiting a gentleman in Australia for him to source the history of these tales so as He can then apply for all the paperwork to be able to export. But since then I found others that have already made kangaroo tales. Also having said this when I want to do is re-glue a kangaroo tail on a 200mm wheel for my T8. Now I know someone will say hell you can get away with it with a scrap and I do thus far but why not; I've seen of such methods. Which leaves me really intrigued. The key is merging that joint on their ends.

Anyway, enough for now thank you Phil

I've read somewhere on a forum that when running to CBN wheels at one time on a tarmac that the machine definitely slows down almost to a crawled rotation. As if the T8 does not have enough torque to spin to heavyweight wheels. Although there have been others who have stated, while having a diamond wheel on the left and the lesser weighted spartan plastic core wheel on the right that there was no issue with slowness of spin.

Hanns has stated to me that this will not be an issue when running to CBNs on one T8 with the extended bolt at one time.

This is almost certainly caused by water dripping onto the rubber drive wheel, rather than a lack of sufficient motor torque.  If the drive wheel gets wet, it causes the drive shaft to slip, which seems like a torque issue if you don't understand what's happened.  I use a 3D printed guard over the drive wheel to minimize the issue, but it still happens occasionally.  Then it's just a matter of drying off the wheel with a rag or paper towel.

yes, thank you I've done the same Shcleifjunkies Has the best 3-D plastic covers right over the drive wheel and the drip trait to its side

I've been trying to fine-tune that set up myself.
I'm actually awaiting the Shop fox electric adjustable table that can also hold two T8s side-by-side. I also like sitting down on my desk chair and bending over to a little table that I bought on Amazon.

I'd say it's about 10" x 9" and 11" high. then I drilled in with four screws to the platform of this table 18 x 14" plastic tray to hold water dripage. I can't figure out how to upload a picture. I'm sure it's what it's in one of those icons up top but can't figure it out. You can also order cheap silicone or rubber doggy mats on Amazon that has a little bit of a lip as well. 

I like the late Dr Vadim Kraichuk Sitting down set up. It's a lot more sturdier than mine not that mine shakes. It's pretty sturdy. But I might build another two by fours as with his.  

Then there's lighting that's another matter altogether as well. I'm awaiting a special lamp from Wood Turners Wonder as well.

I also must add that Slipakniven out of Sweden also sells CBN wheels,that I also have that can also run in normal tap water.

And I do have Tormek's diamond wheels but I gotta say man that ACC stuff can get pricey, even with the filtering of. I've seen videos of others using a sponge as well, which is something I'm gonna do some more exploration towards. Presently I do not like to grind dry. I've heard some horror stories with the possibility of fires from the dust, especially when the workshop is in the basement; even with the best of the best of air dust colectores. Yes it's all dependent on the steel/blade type material one grinds as well.  Furthermore l had my place catch on fire years ago, unrelated of course thank the Lord above so today I'm even more apprehensive towards dry grinding, either with belt or a variable speed grinder.

Anyveeee, izzzza learning...Filippo

Well there are other outfits such as Schleifjunkies (Hanns) that sells 3D prints of added complete trough systems for second wheel adaptions with extended bolt. Even a drip tray overtop that clips into their FVB & Tormek's FVB also with a 3d honing wheel protector overtop with attachments for a second trough system capability. I have it. She clips in perfectly but l haven't tried a second wheel yet. Their CBNs can run on tap water. He states this as such as well whereas WTW dont.

Although there are videos on YouTube explaining tests that were run over a month with Wood Turners Wonder Spartan wheels one with one HoneRite, one with tap water and one with Tormek's ACC. Either way, his test prove when running with WTW's wheels in water with whatever additive is ok. But yet they will not claim that it's OK to run in water other than their Tornado wheels.


I've read somewhere on a forum that when running to CBN wheels at one time on a tarmac that the machine definitely slows down almost to a crawled rotation. As if the T8 does not have enough torque to spin to heavyweight wheels. Although there have been others who have stated, while having a diamond wheel on the left and the lesser weighted spartan plastic core wheel on the right that there was no issue with slowness of spin.

Hanns has stated to me that this will not be an issue when running to CBNs on one T8 with the extended bolt at one time.

US-430 is fine, but what about an US-900? With this bad boy Tormek can be used even as a sword sharpening machine

Or...

What's the hole for at the base of your added angle plate?

Can you measure the difference, say with a caliper or indicator?  Is it consistent? 

Does it happen with just the vertical USB or also with the horizontal and/or the horzizontal/MB-102 when used as an Frontal Vertical Base?  If so, is the movement in the same direction, that is, is the effect on the projection distance the same? 

I wonder if this movement when tightening the screws is caused by a ridge or burr (unevenness/not flat) on the end of the screws. 

I suspect these screws are produces with what is called "rolling" the threads.  That is, the die that forms the threads uses pressure to create the threads by rolling over the screw shaft.  (In the past, thread were "cut" by using threading dies.)  This rolling process pushes material off the end of the screw, leaving a bit of a divot or crater in the middle.  It is typically uneven, being higher on one side or another. 

This burr will often leave marks and/or burrs on the surface against which the screw tightens.  It is easy to remove and make the end of the screw flat and uniform by filing or grinding.  I do this sometimes when I want the end of the screw to be flat and not marr the tightened surface.  This is common when set screws are tightened on shafts, making it difficult to remove the shafts.  Set screws are actually produced with this "cupped" end as a means to make the grip better.  Set screws are also available with flat ends so that they no not marr the surfaces. 

Wow, now that's some amazing input

*How do you go about cleaning that area?

Once there is a build up use an edge, such as the back of a knife, to clean the wheel. All you are really doing is removing spent compound. After that I use light machine oil, or Ballistol (which I prefer) to re-condition the leather before proceeding. You can also apply neats foot oil which is used for conditioning leather let it soak in overnight before applying the machine oil or ballistol. This will extend the life of the leather.

Interesting thank you I will definitely pick up both those products as well as back up

I'm also finding a difficult to do controlled honing with the same USB height measurements while using the MB-102. Naturally, because the leather wheels diameter is smaller than the 250 diamond. Is the only way to fine-tune this measurement by utilizing of the computer Knife Sharpening applications to determine usb height while control honing?

You should pick up the new TORMEK KS-123 Angle Setting jig to give you the same honing angle, or even a little more obtuse, than the sharpening angle. The jig will also help you keep the correct angle when you change stones (wheels) that are different sizes.  I bought the KS-123 a few months back, the first day it was available for sale, and really like the ease and precision of going from sharpening to honing.

I'm also finding a difficult to do controlled honing with the same USB height measurements while using the MB-102. Naturally, because the leather wheels diameter is smaller than the 250 diamond. Is the only way to fine-tune this measurement by utilizing of the computer Knife Sharpening applications to determine usb height while control honing?

You should pick up the new TORMEK KS-123 Angle Setting jig to give you the same honing angle, or even a little more obtuse, than the sharpening angle. The jig will also help you keep the correct angle when you change stones (wheels) that are different sizes.  I bought the KS-123 a few months back, the first day it was available for sale, and really like the ease and precision of going from sharpening to honing.

Thank you.

Yes, I do have the KS 123.  So I guess you're saying use the 123, turn the machine around, Snap in the 123 on the previously set USB, and re-Just the usb's height to match the 123's angle.

I never added oil except as per the instructions when the honing wheel was brand new. It is now pitch black, completely smooth and I never scrape it.

When sharpening the first knife of a new session, I only add a bit of compound, by applying the tip of the tube and barely squeezing while moving the tube sideways. It leaves a tiny bit of paste wrapped twice or three times around the wheel.

I then hone for two to thre passes, then (yuck) remove whatever paste is left on the blade with a finger and rub it back onto the wheel. Makes for a dirty fingertip, but the wheel always feels the same.

Yes, it does leave for dirty finger Tips but I guess this goals with the project. Thank you for your input.

I truly would thank you all for taking the time to offer me some input.

I've gathered some insight with each of your responses.

Thankyou

One further question when you feel that the leather wheel is somewhat bulky in areas as it's spinning against the blades edge.
*How do you go about cleaning that area?

I mean, I could use the backside of my knife with slight pressure to somehow smooth out where the compound has become somewhat bulky and apply another spread out even coat again.

Truly, I like to thank you all for sharing your experience here.

Thank you Phil

It sounds to me like you may be using too much compound?  I can't recall ever having a noticeable buildup (or reading about one) like you described.

Clean it like you described (using the back of a knife as a "scraper)" and maybe try a little less.

I would also caution against using too much oil... it can reduce the effectiveness of the honing compound.

I truly would thank you all for taking the time to offer me some input.

I've gathered some insight with each of your responses.

One further question when you feel that the leather wheel is somewhat bulky in areas as it's spinning against the blades edge.
*How do you go about cleaning that area?

I mean, I could use the backside of my knife with slight pressure to somehow smooth out where the compound has become somewhat bulky and apply another spread out even coat again.

Truly, I like to thank you all for sharing your experience here.

Thank you Phil

Hello everyone,

May sound like a silly question, but I've been thinking about it ever since I've been utilizing my leather wheel on my T8 with the compound.

What are the telltale signs that more compound may be needed to the leather

I'm also finding a difficult to do controlled honing with the same USB height measurements while using the MB-102. Naturally, because the leather wheels diameter is smaller than the 250 diamond. Is the only way to fine-tune this measurement by utilizing of the computer Knife Sharpening applications to determine usb height while control honing?

I've actually been doing it freehand and it does seem by the sounds the leather makes when in contact with the knife edge, that it sounds like I'm at the right angle. I mean the bess machine more often with kitchen knives is giving me a reading under 200 and sometimes lower than 150. I was shocked when I seen some numbers lower than 150 so I actually did two other tests on the same blades at the front and at the rear with approx same figures.
I mean, wouldn't it have been great, and I may be mistaken, to have signed a machine where the slot at the front and the slots at the back would calculate the same angle when using the same height USB. Because the 102 multi base has the long legs. I don't know if I'm clear and what I'm saying, but it is what it is for now thank you all upfront for helping me out with some input.

PHil

Ken great question.

I for sure would find this quantitative analysis very beneficial.

I'm sure our career-minded pro knife, sharpeners maybe be able to chime in and offer us some insight. Hopefully please.

But muddling this in my head right now, I think there maybe several other variables that may influence the uses of ACC. For example, the subjective variable concerning the amount of pressure one puts on the knife while grinding on the diamond stone, which in turn naturally would create a dirtier and more tainted water solution. Now I'm no where near even an intermediate sharpener but l am falling prey to maybe changing the solution more often than l should be even as a hobbiest if you will.

Anyveee, hopefully again, our 33 daily knife sharpening wizards can ante up some insights.

Thxxxx Phil