Recent posts

#1

Knife Sharpening / Re: New angle jig KS-123

Last post by tcsharpen - Today at 04:26:58 AM

(In fact, I'm not sure the spring is needed all that much.)

It may not be entirely needed, but I like that it is there.  It pulls the angled section into the blade.

I don't disagree.

What I did prior to answering earlier was tighten the "Knob for locking Protrusion" enough so that the spring didn't have any affect, and found that I could manipulate the jig quite well without the spring's influence.  But it is a convenient feature.

Oh yes, totally agree with this.  Once locked in place the spring has zero impact.

Not quite what I meant... I just tightened it enough to negate the spring, I could still slide protrusion piece back and forth to set the distance, without the spring doing anything... then tightened it down.

Sure, the key point being you negated the spring, whether locked tight or providing just the right amount of friction.

#2

Knife Sharpening / Re: New angle jig KS-123

Last post by tcsharpen - Today at 04:13:32 AM

Regarding accuracy of the KS-123, my first post in this thread addressed my simple test and observed results. The Calcapp calculated USB height was just .1mm different than was set with the KS-123 and measured with an inexpensive digital caliper.  I think that is within measurement error and accuracy of my caliper.

#3

Knife Sharpening / Re: New angle jig KS-123

Last post by cbwx34 - Today at 04:11:42 AM

(In fact, I'm not sure the spring is needed all that much.)

It may not be entirely needed, but I like that it is there.  It pulls the angled section into the blade.

I don't disagree.

What I did prior to answering earlier was tighten the "Knob for locking Protrusion" enough so that the spring didn't have any affect, and found that I could manipulate the jig quite well without the spring's influence.  But it is a convenient feature.

Oh yes, totally agree with this.  Once locked in place the spring has zero impact.

Not quite what I meant... I just tightened it enough to negate the spring, I could still slide protrusion piece back and forth to set the distance, without the spring doing anything... then tightened it down.

#4

Knife Sharpening / Re: New angle jig KS-123

Last post by tcsharpen - Today at 04:04:35 AM

(In fact, I'm not sure the spring is needed all that much.)

It may not be entirely needed, but I like that it is there.  It pulls the angled section into the blade.

I don't disagree.

What I did prior to answering earlier was tighten the "Knob for locking Protrusion" enough so that the spring didn't have any affect, and found that I could manipulate the jig quite well without the spring's influence.  But it is a convenient feature.

Oh yes, totally agree with this.  Once locked in place the spring has zero impact.

#5

Knife Sharpening / Re: New angle jig KS-123

Last post by cbwx34 - Today at 03:58:28 AM

(In fact, I'm not sure the spring is needed all that much.)

It may not be entirely needed, but I like that it is there.  It pulls the angled section into the blade.

I don't disagree.

What I did prior to answering earlier was tighten the "Knob for locking Protrusion" enough so that the spring didn't have any affect, and found that I could manipulate the jig quite well without the spring's influence.  But it is a convenient feature.

#6

Knife Sharpening / Re: New angle jig KS-123

Last post by tcsharpen - Today at 03:46:47 AM

(In fact, I'm not sure the spring is needed all that much.)

It may not be entirely needed, but I like that it is there.  It pulls the angled section into the blade.

#7

Tormek T-1 and T-2 / Re: revisiting a firestorm

Last post by cbwx34 - Today at 03:13:37 AM

I inadvertantly caused a firestorm when I posted my idea that I thought a knife only side job sharpener might be better served with a T2 instead of a T4 or T8 as his main machine. Without any evil intentions, I apparently dishonored a sacred cow.

I respect the critical replies. They are based on good, solid Tormek experience. However; I don't always agree with them. A primary criticism was that the T2 can only sharpen kitchen knives. (To be fair, as a specialty machine, it is specifically designed for chefs to maintain their knives.) As an old hand with sharpening chisels and plane irons going back to oilstones, fine tooth mill files, and sandpaper on glass, I am quite sure I could sharpen chisels and plane irons with my T2. I freely admit that the T2 is no match for a T4 or T8 with these tools. How often do chefs sharpen woodworking tools?

Most youtube videos show a knife being thoroughly abused before being sharpened. Although the T2 survives this cruel and unusual punishment, how often do we see a good chef actually abuse his knives, the tools of his trade, like this? Yes, the T2 is really designed for knives to be regularly maintained. Why would a top professional want it otherwise?

"Only knives"? Not so. The two Tormek videos demonstrate sharpening other tools which are part of every kitchen such as food processor blades and rotary blades. Especially with food processor blades, I don't know of any other jig controlled method of sharpening these.

The more recent video (Johan and Hugo) includes some things not in the first video. The wheels used originally used were DWF, as opposed to the more recent DF with side diamonds. I reduced a bolster with my DWF, although the newer DF does this more conveniently using the side of the wheel. The newer video also shows some user modifications to expand the range of the jig.

I believe through field use the T2 is evolving into an even more useful machine. I leave it to the reader to decide if he wants to include it in his sharpening kit.

Ken

When I read this post, I'm left with the impression that all you would sharpen is kitchen knives and tools.  You could probably be successful in this limited field as a "side job sharpener".  But if you expand the field to say, sharpening at at a farmer's market, or running a full knife sharpening service, you'd be hard pressed, to run even a part time business with a T-2.  So maybe a better definition is in order.  I'll repeat the same quote I made last time...

...
For a sharpening business, we don't recommend the T-2.
A T-8 with the jig system with SVM-00/45/140 can sharpen way more models of knifes. A knife sharpened and honed with the leather wheel gives a sharper knife than most common new knifes.

This is why we recommend the T-2 to restaurants and chefs, who wanted a fast and reliable machine, that gives them sharp knifes 24/7 in the kitchen.
...

The T-2 is designed for a specific set of knives... those found in the kitchen.  Even in this group, it struggled with some designs, as I detailed in this thread:  T2 Initial Review, although I'm aware that the guide has been updated since I made that post, so it may be more accommodating.

tgbto is correct that bevel thickness is influenced by blade thickness, taper, etc.  But again on kitchen knives, as I brought up in this thread:  Evenness of bevel width with T1/T2 the result will be negligible on most kitchen knives, since they're thinner, have taper from heel to tip, etc. that offset this.  Again, the field is kitchen knives.

Also keep in mind that the the T-2 doesn't handle blade taper from spine to edge well (just like the AngleMaster), and doesn't handle "odd" shaped knives where, for example the handle or bolster gets in the way... something I can easily adjust to on a T-4 or T-8, so again we're back to a limited number of knives.

So, my .02 the T-2 could be a "main machine" if the sharpening was mainly limited to light duty of primarily kitchen style knives, and a few associated tools that were shown in the recent T2 "202" video, (and also the Round Blade attachment).  Or very light duty where you might get a variety of knives, but have the time to individually address the issues that each knife presents.  (And you'd probably need to develop the skill to freehand sharpen certain knives.)

But I believe that if a person is looking for their first machine to sharpen knives, and/or other items, unless their need/desire meets this pretty limited criteria, they'd be better served investing in the more versatile models.

#8

Tormek T-1 and T-2 / Re: revisiting a firestorm

Last post by tgbto - Today at 01:14:05 AM

At this point, I would like to suspend this conversation, leaving you with the last word. I want to do careful testing with my T2 and photograph the bevels. (With my family obligations this may not be speedy.) When I complete this testing, I will post the photos, regardless of which position they support. Is that agreeable with you?

Just out of curiosity, do you have any hands on experience with the T2?

Ken

Ken, this is fine. This reminds me of a line I read on another post :

i believe we have squeezed as much useful juice as this issue has to offer. Let's move on.

But it seems the OP in this more recent post has a different opinion and thinks it is important to revisit the firestorm. So revisit we do...

I have no hands on experience with the T2. However I have experience with a Trizor XV which works exactly the way the T2 works, or with the Ken Onion Sharpener in its original edition, along with enough math background to trust the fact that under reasonably applicable hypotheses to our knife sharpening situation :

sin a = ht / bl where a is the edgle angle (measured @ 90° from the edge) in dps, ht is half the thickness of the blade at the top of the edge and bl the bevel length.

So with an angle guide, a and sin a remain constant, so bl increases with ht. Or if ht increases and you want bl to remain constant, you have to increase sin a and therefore increase a.

Or as this non-Tormek related site puts it :

On knives where the tip is inline with the spine and where there is not a distal taper, the effect is more pronounced. A wider bevel in this circumstance is a purely cosmetic concern since the angle is constant.

Which I think is about the same thing I said, english mistakes aside.

There is also this site and many others.

As you said it too, the T2 is pivot only. The same causes will have the same effects, so you will get the same result as on the T8 if you pivot along the laser line instead of lifting. When you lift, you increase the edge angle and comparatively reduce the bevel height. But maybe I missed a key point...

#9

Knife Sharpening / Re: new sharpener with a few p...

Last post by RichColvin - Yesterday at 10:41:20 PM

I've been round the bend with this issue, too.  The truth is that it's just a limitation of the current system, and there's no perfect way around it.  If you draw the blade straight across, keeping the jig perpendicular to the guide bar, and only raise your elbow to bring the belly into contact with the stone--as suggested by Tormek--you will have a higher bevel angle toward the tip. 

If, on the other hand, you pivot the jig to get the belly/tip lower down on the stone, there will be some inconsistency in that area, although it can be minimized with practice.  However ... there are some situations where no amount of pivoting can get the tip low enough to match the angle on the rest of the knife.

These days I don't let it wreck my head.  The angle difference generally isn't that extreme, and the system gets knives sharp, and quickly. 

I would ad to this:  identify a process which is repeatable.  In my book, that is the #1 key to success.

#10

Knife Sharpening / Re: New angle jig KS-123

Last post by cbwx34 - Yesterday at 10:16:06 PM

This was a disappointment. After biting the bullet and getting MB-102, a second USB and the KS-123, which was out of stock in almost every shop here in Sweden, only to find out that the angle meter was delivered without the "retractable part".

Does this render the meter useless, or can I use it somehow?

Is the "retractable part" the spring?  (Can't tell for sure on the diagram.) Anyway, I'd let Tormek support know right away... to get a replacement, and also let them know if it's a production issue.  (Might check the box closely and see if it's in there.)

If it is the spring, I'd say yes, in the interim you can still use it, just slide it forward with with your thumb/finger.  Once you set the "protrusion" it's not needed anyway.  (In fact, I'm not sure the spring is needed all that much.)