Broken delivery T8

[Thomas S.]

Hello,
my name is Thomas and I am from Austria / Tyrol. I have been following your forum for some time and am fascinated by the perfectionism of some people here.
I also think it's awesome that you reveal your know-how and make no secret of it! Also ingenious and thankful that the Excel table for the height settings was just made so available.

After long back and forth, I have decided for a T8 and after some delivery delay, it was delivered to me by DHL yesterday.
The slight damage to the box did not bother me much. But when I wanted to lift the machine out of the original packaging, I discovered three small broken plastic piece between machine and Styrofoam (Styrofoam was also broken). Upon closer inspection of the inside of the machine (with the lamp) I discovered the breakage. It will be with a screw of the engine cover.   
I reported it to the company I ordered it from. She said that I should make a claim with DHL.
The damage report was made at DHL. I'm curious what comes out of it.

Did you ever see something like that? Must probably point to a greater impact load or what do you think?

Thank you very much
Thomas

PS. I hope the Google Translate makes sense 

[Ken S]

Welcome to the forum, Thomas. I regret that your T8 was damaged in shipping. You did right to file a damage claim with the shipping company.

You should also contact Tormek Support (support@tormek.se) Support is quite reliable in handling warranty work.

I have found that the boxes for new Tormeks are well designed. Where the problems generally happen is between the Tormek box and the outer shipping box. This problem is not unique to Tormek. Outer boxes need to be much larger and well padded. Sadly, this detail is often overlooked.

Please keep us posted. Hopefully you will have a good resolution soon. We want to know either way.

Ken

[Twisted Trees]

Under UK law, it is the retailer who needs to be responsible for claiming from the delivery company, they have an obligation to ensure it is in perfect condition when received, if not they would need to send a replacement arrange collection and make their claim. Much better for the consumer, and puts an obligation of careful packaging on the retailer.

[Ken S]

I like that law. When I ship a package, I include plenty of packing material to prevent the contents from rattling around. How many times have we received packages with almost no packing material? The merchant has almost no control over rough handling during shipping. (The only control is not to do business with the worst offenders.) The merchant can control the packing by using the right packing and supervising the packing.

In this case, whether the merchant or the shipper corrects the problem, I believe that Tormek support should be notified right away. I also believe that support should be advised on the outcome, either to compliment the excellent service or complain.

In our real world, these problems occasionally occur. Whenever support becomes involved, I always encourage members to post and share their experiences, good or bad. I would not delete posts with poor service. We deserve to know the honest reports. I am pleased that to date, reports have been positive.
Thomas, I hope your conclusion will be positive. Please post it, good or bad.

Ken

[van]

I am very sorry for what happened.
Surely the support of Tormek assistance will meet you.
I did not understand if the T8 had arrived with the only Tormek package or was inside a second shipping box.
Now for practice when I receive a package that shows a small damage even only external I always declare to the courier, in writing, "ACCEPTED [/ u] WITH RESERVE" [/ u]
This small sentence protects you from discoveries unwanted towards the courier or third parties about possible future claims.
Good luck

[Elden]

I like that law. When I ship a package, I include plenty of packing material to prevent the contents from rattling around. How many times have we received packages with almost no packing material? The merchant has almost no control over rough handling during shipping. (The only control is not to do business with the worst offenders.) The merchant can control the packing by using the right packing and supervising the packing.

Having a choice of different shippers is nice. Seeing the results of shipping (here in  the USA), I have formed a definite opinion of which shipper I prefer to use.

I had a son who worked for one of the major shipping companies. Hearing him describe how packages were handled, revealed why items are so often are damaged in shipping.

I enjoy growing HOT 🔥 chili peppers and have fellow chiliheads that I supply peppers to. I shipped some from Kansas to California via my preferred shipper. They were contained in a plywood box custom built to fit inside of the shipper's standard cardboard shipping box. The peppers arrived in excellent condition. Overkill? Maybe......

Story moral:  It is better to be overly cautious than to be made sorry by inadequate shipping protection.

[Thomas S.]

Hello,

Thank you for your answers and sorry for my late reply. I was just on vacation with the family.

Unfortunately, nothing new has emerged yet. Upon request from DHL, I have again sent photos of the damage and the packaging (Friday 24.06). Unfortunately, I have not received an answer yet 

@ Ken: Thanks for pointing out, I will contact Tormek Support. The outer box was certainly not big enough. The original box fits perfectly into the outer box 

@ Twisted Trees: such a law as in England would be great! I have ever had a problem with a supply of a guide rail for a circular saw. The Austrian dealer has had the defective rail pick up and immediately sent a new rail (super dealer)! Unfortunately, not all are so good and customer friendly.

@ Van: yes there was still a box over the original Tormek packaging. Unfortunately accurate and only with a bit of paper between the two upper lids. I did not look too closely at the carton during the takeover. The messenger has also put the box "right". I only noticed it when I unpacked the box in the apartment. Will not happen to me anymore!

@ Elden: I can already imagine how they deal with the packages.

I'm curious when DHL will contact me.
Will keep you updated.
Best regards
Thomas

[Thomas S.]

Hello,

Now I would like to contact you again as promised and announce the course.

The damage report to the shipping company was unfortunately negative for me. The statement was: "Your above shipment was damaged during transport - we are very sorry. However, we can not refund the damage you have suffered.
As the postal company of the country of destination informed us, the packaging was not sufficient to protect the contents safely. According to our general terms and conditions, however, consignment contents must be packed in such a way that damage during transport is excluded. In this case, we can not assume any liability. "

The online retailer then recommended that I file a complaint with the shipping company. Since I'm not a contractor with the shipping company, can (according to my research) only the online retailer to appeal.

After further, for me unsuccessful, mail traffic I had to send the machine on own costs to the sales Germany. The repair (replacement of the engine cover) in the distribution was on goodwill.
Many thanks to the helpfulness of the sales company Germany and to the Tormek support.

Check your parcels on delivery very accurately !!!
And even better, who can should spend more money at the local dealer rather than ordering at the cheapest online shop.

Best regards
Thomas

[Georgie]

The statement was: "Your above shipment was damaged during transport - we are very sorry. However, we can not refund the damage you have suffered...as the postal company of the country of destination informed us, the packaging was not sufficient to protect the contents safely. According to our general terms and conditions, however, consignment contents must be packed in such a way that damage during transport is excluded. In this case, we can not assume any liability. "

The online retailer then recommended that I file a complaint with the shipping company. Since I'm not a contractor with the shipping company, can (according to my research) only the online retailer to appeal.

After further, for me unsuccessful, mail traffic I had to send the machine on own costs to the sales Germany. The repair (replacement of the engine cover) in the distribution was on goodwill.
Many thanks to the helpfulness of the sales company Germany and to the Tormek support.

Check your parcels on delivery very accurately !!!
And even better, who can should spend more money at the local dealer rather than ordering at the cheapest online shop.

Best regards
Thomas

Terribly sorry to hear that Thomas. You'll note that I bolded the portion of your post where DHL stated that the (Austrian?) postal service had made a determination that the packaging was insufficient to protect the contents. That is the fault of the vendor.

I understand you've more or less resolved the issue but I feel that if available to you a review of the vendor is warranted (we here in the states have "Yelp" however I'm not sure if they are international or not)...I would state exactly what transpired: that an official  determination was made that the vendor's packaging was insufficient to protect the delivery of a costly piece of equipment. I realize some people might find that "shutting the barn door after the horse is out" (I'd love to see how Google Translate handles that American expression! Lol!) but the fact is you may keep other people from suffering the same consequences or, even better, though I suspect unlikely, cause the vendor to change their shipping practices and policies. She (I presume) was absolutely off the mark that the fault lay with the shipper, the fault lay with them, the vendor. I'm sorry they didn't own up to that fact.

Best wishes,
George

[Ken S]

George,

The issue of poor shipping is industry wide. The shipping companies are all too often blamed for poor packing on the part of the vendors. How many packages have we all received without adequate packing to keep the contents from moving?

In an earlier post, one of our members astutely noted that in the journey from the wholesaler to the dealer, products are usually shipped on skids and delivered in big trucks. In the journey from the dealer to the customer, products are shipped individually, and must rely on the dedication of the packer. This is a good reason to purchase directly from a dealer whenever possible and avoid the risky last leg of the journey.

Unfortunately, it is often the heaviest and largest items which are most at risk. My inadequately packed Tormek Work Station was damaged in transit. It was packed in a double box, however, there was no padding between the boxes. Until this issue is resolved, we must keep complaining.

Ken

[Thomas S.]

Hello George,

because the online shop in my opinion was not really helpful or accommodating, I have (justified for me) made 1 point Google rating.
At the first very detailed review I have described the respective point deduction and would have come to minus 5 points rating. The next morning, the lawyer threatened me. Because I also had parts of the email traffic in the review I deleted them.

Afterwards I only mentioned the very long 14 and 24 working days delivery time, although according to order 3 to 5 days were specified. Also, the defective delivered machine had to be sent at my expense for repair. The next morning, the lawyer was again threatened.

Thereupon I deleted all text of the 1 point review. The answer from the online shop was: "You will receive a reminder from our lawyer in the next 14 days. We will delete the Google rating directly from our lawyer at Google. The costs for this will be invoiced separately. We are also examining the extent to which we can still bill you for the costs of the graceful repair. Talks have already been held with all those involved. "

Now a week has passed and I'm curious. The 1 point rating has not been canceled yet 

Best regards
Thomas

[Ken S]

Thomas,

I have two suggestions for you. First, you should inform Tormek support of how you have been treated. I don't know how much support can do, however, it is important that they be informed. Good or bad, the way you as a customer are treated by a Tormek dealer reflects on Tormek's reputation.

Second, I just checked on Tormek's Austrian site. I know enough German to know that Händler means dealer in English. I counted sixty eight Tormek dealers in Austria. For future business with Tormek products, I suggest that you find a Tormek dealer near you. You might want to check out several until you find one where you are very comfortable. You want a dealer who is knowledgeable, makes you feel welcome, and gives you excellent service. Where I live in Ohio, I am most fortunate to have three dealers I trust. One dealer is a trusted personal friend. Two are located in Amish villages. I have been a customer in one of these stores for more than forty five years. In the other store, I enjoy listening to the customers and clerks speaking the Amish German dialect.

I rarely get such happy feelings shopping online.

I hope you will finally get a good resolution. Do keep us posted.

Ken

[John_B]

Good advice Ken. With worldwide distribution it must be difficult for Tormek to insure that their standards are always maintained.

[Georgie]

Hello George,

because the online shop in my opinion was not really helpful or accommodating, I have (justified for me) made 1 point Google rating.
At the first very detailed review I have described the respective point deduction and would have come to minus 5 points rating. The next morning, the lawyer threatened me. Because I also had parts of the email traffic in the review I deleted them.

Afterwards I only mentioned the very long 14 and 24 working days delivery time, although according to order 3 to 5 days were specified. Also, the defective delivered machine had to be sent at my expense for repair. The next morning, the lawyer was again threatened.

Thereupon I deleted all text of the 1 point review. The answer from the online shop was: "You will receive a reminder from our lawyer in the next 14 days. We will delete the Google rating directly from our lawyer at Google. The costs for this will be invoiced separately. We are also examining the extent to which we can still bill you for the costs of the graceful repair. Talks have already been held with all those involved. "

Now a week has passed and I'm curious. The 1 point rating has not been canceled yet 

Best regards
Thomas

and it wont be Thomas...

Hi Ken. Yes I absolutely agree with you. In cases such as Thomas' complaining is about all one can do as well as post an accurate truthful online review when an eVendor is involved.  As to his treatment at the hands of this particular eVendor which now that I've seen his most recent post, I find it worse than shabby, in fact the word coercion comes to mind. I agree with you again, Tormek should be informed.

I would point out that their threats of Attorney action are absolute BS under the proviso that the review was factual; a lousy review does not constitute slander. It simply reinforces to me that this particular vendor is petrified of a bad review not to mention doing Tormek themselves a huge disservice. Another reason Tormek should be informed.

I understand that the Translator may not have been exactly precise but really, "our attorney at Google?" that's some seriously ugly stone plugging swarf. As to being threatened of being billed by the eVendor for the repair the German dealership provided free of charge...I wouldn't just write Tormek I'd call them.


Full and unmitigated apologies to the Tormek Forum Community if I'm being too passionate in my response. Ken please, if this post is deemed to be inappropriate I will fully understand any action you choose to take as forum admin. Thomas I am thoroughly glad the dealership in Germany took care of you.

George

[Ken S]

George,

Don't apologize. I feel the same way that you do.

Ken