Jigs

[Flame]

Thanks guys for your input and taking the time to reply.Cost not being a factor I will be getting the T8.  Bill.

[Ken S]

Bill,

Jeff's comment is wise. There should be joy in getting and using a Tormek. For the most part, my life is very simple and "needs" oriented. I do enjoy my "wants" splurges. Photography, Mac and Tormek comprise the majority of my wants. Apple and Tormek put a fun factor in first opening their products. Enjoy the experience.

Be sure to read the first topic posted in Tormek General Questions, the Tips and Techniques topic. I started it to get new owners off to a good start. It has grown much too long. I really need to edit it. In fact, it really should be a video. You can learn much from sharpening a humble Irwin blue chip chisel.

By all means, register your Tormek through the tormek.com website. This establishes your warranty. Once you log in, be sure to watch the videos, especially the T8 video with Alan Holtham. It is very well done, and more in depth than most earlier videos. Registration also documents your serial number. When my first T7 was stolen, I emailed Tormek to get the serial number for the police report. Tormek replied promptly.

Spend some time getting acquainted with your Tormek. Read the handbook. Make notes in it Before you even mount the grinding wheel, become fluent with mounting and dismounting the water trough. The T8 water trough is held in place with a magnet near the bottom. A gentle arcing motion, pulling the bottom away, releases it. The easiest way to learn this is before introducing water and the grinding wheel. This is an easy but necessary skill. Learning it will help your technical fluency; not bothering to learn it will add to your frustration.

Don't lose the plastic shipping sleeve attached to the shaft. You will need it later when you transport your Tormek (grinding wheel removed is the preferred method)

Learn the feel and sound of Tormek grinding. Set it up in good light, especially when learning the Anglemaster. (Good lighting is covered in the handbook, although I stumbled upon it later when I set up my Tormek outside one day.)

Get a turkey baster. These simple kitchen tools are the cat's meow for removing water without spillage. The grocery store variety work fine, however, I wish I had splurged and bought the Lee Valley model. It is expensive, but it looks like a joy to use, and you will use a turkey baster every time you sharpen.

Keep posting and keep learning. Enjoy the journey.

Ken

[Herman Trivilino]

Forget comparing price. When you add in the TT-50 truing tool and the SE-77 not supplied with the T4, the price is essentially equal.

In that case, portability is the only issue to consider because the SE-77 and especially the TT-50 are essential. And even then, I would carefully consider the portability issue. Moving the machine around the shop is not difficult. If there's a problem just remove the grindstone to reduce the weight. If you need the portability because you're a professional sharpener, I would still choose the T8 because it is heavier duty and therefore more suited to commercial applications. I have a hard time imagining a scenario where the T4 would be an advantage because of its portability.

I've said this before. It is a common marketing scheme to make a scaled-down version of a piece of equipment at a bit more than half the price of the original. I think it works because the buyer doesn't have to rationalize the purchase price in one step. First, become convinced that the lower-priced unit is a worthwhile use of your money. Once you do that you've mentally committed yourself to spending that much money. Now, for step two, all you have to do is justify the smaller amount more needed to purchase the better piece of equipment.

[Ken S]

Herman,

I agree with your thoughts, especially the marketing scheme (certainly not unique to any one company or industry. I am old enough to remember the introduction of "compact" cars.) The smaller size Tormek has been made for many years, and directed primarily at the European market. With the introduction of the zinc top on the T4, the smaller unit became much more viable.

The T4 is not only lighter than the T8, it is smaller, more compact. In a shop with enough room for a sharpening station, the T8 is certainly the logical choice. In a smaller shop, where space is at a premium and there is no alloted permanent sharpening station, in my opinion, the more compact T4 may be the logical choice.

Unfortunately, we rarely have an opportunity to compare them side by side in actual use. A typical dealer store will have an open (but not set up to actually be used) T7 sitting on a shelf, If there is a T4, it is usually in an unopened box on a lower shelf. As an aside, the T7 at one local dealer store in a large metropolitan area still had the old one piece leather honing wheel mounted. In this sad state of marketing, the only way I have been able to realistically compare the two sizes is by using them side by side in my shop.

Even at shows, often only the larger size is demonstrated. Seasonal special price reductions, generally including a "free" jig or accessory, are generally limited to the larger size models.

The imp in me would like to go to a dealer store and purchase both a T4 and a T8, informing the dealer that I would give both models a good faith trial, and would be returning the size which did not suit my requirements. I would not really do this; it seems unfair to the dealer. However, it also seems unfair to me for the dealer to expect me to invest in a Tormek without first having both models demonstrated to me in the store and having an in store chance to try both. Would we purchase a car or truck without a test drive?

Having used both sizes, I could be quite happy with either. The T8 is certainly a fine machine, a worthy long term investment. On the other hand, I am not aware of cases of T4 owners trading up.
I no not speak against either model; they are both fine tools. I do advocate fair and full evaluation of all the options.

Ken

[Herman Trivilino]

On the other hand, I am not aware of cases of T4 owners trading up.

In case you misunderstood me, I wasn't talking about making the purchase of the T4. Just rationalizing the purchase in one's mind. Once that's done, it's much easier to rationalize the additional cost of the T8 than it is to rationalize the full price of the T8.

You make a good point about shop size. I hadn't thought of that. There may be people who just don't have room in their shop for a T8. Again, though, that's hard for me to imagine.

[cbwx34]

My .02... I think cost and intended use are probably the main factors.  Space (mainly storage) would have to be at a premium... since, in use, you still need pretty much the same amount of room to work.  If mainly used for knives, (like me), the added jigs are of little value.  (I've maintained my stones with an XXC DMT for years, and have been able to keep it true, at least enough for knives... probably not accurate enough for the other uses though).  For the home user, cost of the larger stones may not be worth it, since you may never "wear out" even the smaller stone of the T-4.  So, lower cost, light use, and type of sharpening (knives) may point to the T-4.  And of course the reverse... heavier use, sharpening more than knives, need for the included accessories, etc. point to the T-8.  (That's my take anyway).

[Ken S]

I bought my T7 in 2009 because my hands hurt after working too much with water stones. Ernie Conover, the teacher and guru I consulted, spoke well of the Tormek, but felt he could achieve similar results using the Tormek without many of the jigs. With the benefit of half a century of extensive sharpening, he certainly has the skill. For the rest of us, the jigs help achieve a higher quality edge quickly and consistently.

You won't regret choosing the T8. Incidentally, all the jigs fit all Tormeks. If you should someday decide that you want to add a compact Tormek for traveling, all your jigs will work.

Enjoy your new Tormek.

Ken