stone grading thoughts

[Ken S]

One of the unique foundations of the Tormek is the ability to grade the grinding wheel, thus making one wheel serve as both coarse and fine. Based on studying an early edition of the handbook, I believe grading the wheel began when Tormek introduced manmade grinding wheels. The manmade stones were coarser than the natural stones used originally. They would cut faster, but left a less smooth finish. I would speculate that the original purpose of the stone grader was to "correct" the grit of the manmade stone.

Traditional basic Tormek technique (I suspect to stress simplicity for perspective buyers) stressed just coarse and fine, 220 and 1000 grit. This is a black or white approach. Stig has suggested a more gray shades approach. This opens up many possibilities. For the sake of simplicity, let's focus on a grit size of approximately 600. This would be obtained by grading the stone only briefly with the fine side. Some might consider this incomplete grading. I submit that it is more sophisticated grading. Six hundred grit regular grinding wheels have been available as after market for some time. Diamond and CBN wheels are now made in 600 grit.

Now for the experimental part: With skill and experience, Stig is able to fine tune his grinding wheel with the standard Tormek stone grader. For those of us with less skill,like me, I suggest acquiring a medium silicon sharpening stone. If the coarse side of the stone grader produces a 220 grit wheel surface, and the fine side produces a 1000 grit surface, why wouldn't a medium silicon carbide stone produce something in the middle near 600 grit?

I am presently away from home, and have not tried this. I would welcome comments.

Whenever someone I respect can do something I can not, I suspect "operator error" on my part. Steve uses the blackstone very successfully with knives. My initial efforts have not been as successful. Stig has very good and innovative results with the stone grader, much more so than mine have been. In both cases, I am working on developing my skills.

I hear complaints about using stone grader requiring too much time. I do not believe the diamond grinding wheel on the T2 has any regrading capability. Magnus reports it cuts very quickly. Maybe the 600 grit is coarse enough to cut quickly and fine enough not to require regrading.

I do not expect the forum to purchase diamond or CBN wheels in great quantities, however, spending twenty dollars US for a try with a medium silicon carbide stone sounds doable to me. I will be at Hartville Hardware later this morning. I will check out their sharpening stones..

Ken

[SharpenADullWitt]

I would speculate that the original purpose of the stone grader was to "correct" the grit of the manmade

Ken

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQRtKgou-gg

I expect Jeff explained quite well, what the purpose of the stone grader is for.  To break up the particles into smaller bits, while leaving them in the binder.  Sounds similar to a Nagura stone, in using the slurry on bench stones (where they wouldn't have gravity spinning them around), to me.
I suspect the Tormek stones are a course and medium grit (don't really know the SB), and the original stone, is somewhere between that, and their SJ stones (fine).
The 600 may be obtainable with less time and/or pressure of the grader (not corrector) stone, but I don't see 1000 as fine, personally.  (medium and quite useable, yes)  The fine is obtainable with other stones, as the SJ, or the polishing of the leather wheel.  (I think your overthinking things Ken)

I understand in part, the problems associated with the stone grader.  Read common questions about the dishing, etc. and I think so much of it, is lack of practice and education.  In some respects they do themselves the same disservice, having professional presenters, as they do service.  They sell them, but they make it look instant, quick and easy, in the world of infomercials we live in (where you can find products in garage sales, due to disgust later).  The fact that it isn't cheap, slows down any impluse buys.  But you have been a demonstrator, and I signed up for a demo class, at a local store about the Tormek (using).  That class turned into a general sharpening class and pushing their bench stones, with no Tormek use or demo at all.  I think some of the demo's would be better spent in a class format, personally.

This is one reason why I keep going back to Jeff's videos.  He really did pack so much information into them, that you don't catch it all the first time (subtle).

[Ken S]

I agree with much of what you say, SADW. I frequently search for Tormek related videos online. I find most of the "you tubes" disappointing. Jeff's are a notable exception. I never fail to learn something from watching. They ably demonstrate the standard Tormek.

I am a firm believer in being fluent with a number of techniques, and varying the procedure when necessary. I find Steve's different approach to using the Tormek (wheel turning awayfrom the edge in horizontal sleeves) very suitable for me. Steve has posted links to several segments of his Sharpening School DVD on the forum.

I realize there are mixed feelings about the stone grader. The short video on the tormek website is a good start to understanding it. We certainly need more in depth usage videos.

I think there are two main problems associated with the stone grader. I agree with you that there is a common lack of understanding with using it. Stig uses it extensively and believes strongly in its value. In my case, that makes me believe the problem is my own lack of skill using it.

The second problem with the stone grader is that, like the grinding wheel, it is consumable. While demonstrating, I did not realize that my difficulty was due to the coarse side having become worn smooth. At the time, I was standing in front of the jigs and accessories rack. Pulling a new stone grader off the rack would have solved my problem. (Like neglecting to tighten the TT-50, this shouldn't happen again.) Someone doing a lots of sharpening and/or for business should have a spare stone grader on hand. Also, whenever you order a replacement grinding wheel, consider ordering a replacement stone grader at the same time.

SADW, you have mentioned that disappointing seminar before. Bad classes are really unfortunate, and yours was a real stinker.  Hartville Hardware, where I demonstrated, is the largest hardware store in the country. (Hartville is a small town in NE Ohio.) The store itself is seven acres. During the shows, there are also hour long seminars offered in the lower level. If the seminar is well done, it is an excellent way to learn. Many of the seminar teachers are big name people in woodworking. My one regret with working the show was that I was unable to attend Mark Duginske's bandsaw class. Mark is Mister Bandsaw. I took a one day bandsaw class with him twenty years ago and really learned how to tune a bandsaw.

I hope Tormek will offer more seminars. Purchasing a Tormek is and should be a long term investment. It deserves "due diligence" in making the decision and good training. A proper seminar is far superior to watching a quick demo in a crowded room. The smartest customer I met was actually a store employee. He was just about ready to purchase a Tormek, but had questions about T4 or T7. Working at the store, he knew Friday evening was a very slow period. He had the Tormek guy to himself. He asked some very good questions; I enjoyed chatting with him. In my opinion, seminars and slow periods are the ways to maximize a show experience.

Ken

ps No luck finding a medium oilstone. I will try a couple from my collection.

pps Regarding "coarse and fine": I agree, 1000 grit is not really very fine. Coarse and finer might be a better description.