Spokeshave Challenge

[RobinW]

Hi Klaus

I have never come across a Miller Falls tool like your photos, but it looks interesting. I did a search and on the following website someone has complied a history of the company and its tools - but I didn't see any reference to a spokeshave. According to Wikipedia the company was taken over by a Chinese company, but it is not clear if still in business.

http://oldtoolheaven.com

I tried a search on the Forum because I thought I had (a long time ago now) posted some photographs of a jig I made with acrylic sheet (just because I had some stuff lying around) and this accepts the tangs of the blades for aged wooden spokeshaves. However I can't find the photographs. If anyone can point me in the right direction, I have an inkling of an idea.

Can you post the sizes of the blade - length, inside diameter etc.. I assume the ground face is straight across. Is it a tangent to the outer surface or angled in?

Robin

[Waterstone]

Hi Robin,

thanks a lot for jumping in that quick. Lee Valley has a nice description of the cigar shave.

http://www.leevalley.com/newsletters/Woodworking/2/2/patents.htm

The inside diameter of the blade is rather exactly 17 mm, the overall length is 56 mm and the side bevels are about 55 degrees (where it meets the screws). You spotted it right, the ground face is a tangent to the outer surface. It's not allowed to be only slightly convex since the tool wouldn't cut then. If it's slightly hollow from the Tormek stone it should work fine.

Klaus

[RobinW]

Hi Klaus

(As there are restrictions concerning photographs per post, this reply will be in at least two posts - assuming I can upload the photographs!)

As a trial effort before making the metal spokeshave jig shown above, I made some jigs from acrylic sheet. One of these clamped the flat spokeshave blade between two acrylic sheets, the lower sheet had a tail to fit into the SE76 square edge jig.

I have now bodged one of these jigs to accept a 'half-round tool'. (Bodged - a UK term meaning in the polite terms, rough and ready!)

I had a piece of 22mm outside diameter copper pipe (standard size for domestic plumbing in UK), so I cut this lengthwise to make a 'half-round tool' to simulate your Miller Falls blade. I then cut a slot in one of the acrylic sheets, at the same distance from the front edge of the sheet to match the internal diameter of the pipe. The tool is then clamped in place by the second sheet of the jig.

Fig 1 - This shows the 'tool' clamped between two plates. The upper plate has a slot (at the diameter distance back from the front edge) as more readily shown in Fig 2. The piece of mahogany between the plates, towards the left side, is to stop the clamping plate being canted (angled) over too far. You can also see the start of the tail on the far left which fits into the SE76.


Fig 3 shows the whole arrangement fitted into the SE76.


Now we come to the fun bit!

[Ken S]

Robin,

Is "bodged" related to "bodger", meaning the traditional wood turners who worked outside making chair parts quickly?

Ken

[RobinW]

Now that I missed the vital point on uploading photographs, I will again attempt to load Figs 1, 2 and 3

[RobinW]

We'll let's have another go as my last post was rejected!

Fig 4 shows the SE76 on the vertical usb so that grinding is towards the blade edge.



**I do not recommend this is tried, because to get the blade edge tangential to the wheel, the usb needs to be high and there is a danger that the blade edge will catch and try and push the tool/jig assembly back under the usb, with disastrous results to wheel, tool, and operator!**

(There is a recent post on the Forum where someone was having a knife catching and this was due to the high angle employed - so you have been warned!)

[RobinW]

Swiftly moving on to Plan B - Figs 5 and 6 show the assembly with the usb in horizontal position and grinding away from the edge - which I think would be better for this type of tool. However we now hit another snag. Due to the SE76 having restricted leftwards movement as its mounting lug come up against the usb. So my jig (no sizes worked out in advance,) cannot move the tool across the full with of the wheel. So any jig of this form needs a built in offset to compensate for the SE76 obstruction.

[RobinW]

Here comes Fig 6:-

[RobinW]

Plan C - Fig 7 shows the jig removed from the SE76 and resting on a SVD110 tool rest. One thing I have found when using the SVD110 is, despite trying to apply a light touch, any tool I have tried to sharpen tends to get pulled up off the SVD110.




**I have not attempted to 'sharpen' my copper pipe tool as non-ferous metal would clog up the grinding wheel and create another dangerous situation.**

However despite not trying it, I am sure that a simple clamping method of a half-round tool can provide a route to success.

I have also thought of clamping the half round tool (similar method as Miller Falls use in the spokeshave) to a suitably sized length of round bar, which in turn has either handles or a yoke for clamping to the SVD110.

I cut the slot in the acrylic sheet using a Fein Multicaster tool. (There are other manufacturers of oscillating head tools on the market.)

I took me a very short time to make the 'half-round tool' and bodged jig to prove a principle. It took me much longer to resize the photographs and go through the ......... process of getting them uploaded within the restrictions applied by the Forum!

[RobinW]

Ken you are correct that bodged and bodgers are related. The rudimentary method of bodgers work is usually associated for all other types of work associated with some form of ingenuity or lateral thinking in order to get a job done. Also associated with botched (usually when someone else has been paid to do a job!).

[Waterstone]

Wow Robin, I'm blown away completely!

First and foremost lots of thank yous to you for taking all this time to make such a fine jig and to explain it that brilliantly... and to take all the time to load up so many pics! I was just asking for an idea and you did it already, incredible. I owe you something, my friend, that's for sure. I should be able to take a big advantage of your ingenious work. Fortunately I own a Fein Multimaster so the work on such a jig can be started soon. I will have to go for an acrylic sheet that will allow me to do a few attempts. Knowing me, it will be necessary to make more than one to get it right. Can't wait to begin the work though it will take much longer to finish it than you did it. I'll keep you updated.

Thanks another time!

Klaus

[RobinW]

Klaus - I received your message, but as you will see elsewhere I seem to be incapable of sending a message.

Keep us posted with your progress - ups and downs, any problems, success!

Robin

[Waterstone]

Thanks a lot Robin.

The work will start probably next week. When I'm done I'll be happy to post a few pics.

Klaus

[Waterstone]

Hi all,

meanwhile I finished a jig for the oddly shaped cigar shave cutter. First and foremost I've to thank Robin for helping me to get into the saddle. And more than that for patiently answer any question I had regardless how silly the've been 

Like Robin proposed the jig was made of acrylic sheet (6 mm). The circular blade is sitting firmly on a halfround piece of acryl. The first attempt wasn't successfull, when I tried to hold the cutter by letting the rear edge running through a slot in the top plate. Wasn't able to make this slot in a way that it held the cutter truly rectangular and tight. This is how it looks (the screw heads are countersunk to get a flat bottom surface):



The dismantled parts:



After grinding the cutter:



As you can spot the edge isn't dead straight but very slightly concave. User error however. It was the first attempt after all. I'm not familiar yet with the jig and with the SVD-110 use in this case.

The jig is shaped in a way that it can be inserted into the SE-76. This would probably sort out the above mentioned issue. But the blade has to be sharpened in a way that it has to be presented nearly rectangularly to the stone. Currently I've no idea how this can be managed with the SE-76.

Anyway, after some (quick) honing on a flat medium, the cutter is definitely sharper than I ever was able to get it by hand sharpening. The tool works how it should, it's a joy!



Klaus

[RobinW]

Well done Klaus

Many thanks for your compliment and there is no such thing as a silly question. I'm very pleased that you're getting success and the shaving in your photograph looks good.

A couple of comments if I may.

a) Is the outside surface of the blade (in the area about to be sharpened) flat over the length of the blade or is it already concave? Or is it now concave as you may have ground it that way?

b) Did you polish up the inside surface of the blade near the cutting edge? I would suggest this be done first, and could be done by using a piece of dowel with wet and dry paper wrapped round it, and move up through the grits. Then hand hold the blade and polish the inside edge of the blade on the Tormek narrow honing wheels. (It's like flattening and polishing the back of a plane blade before sharpening the bevel.)

c) I think you will get a better edge using the SE-76. If you look at the 'Underhand Sharpening' topic you can get sharpening away from the edge and by raising the USB you should get tangential blade angles that you need. If you mounted your jig into the SE-76, what is the protrusion from the SE-76 to the front edge of your jig? (I'll have a simulation and see if my hypothesis above is feasible.)

d) I would also suggest that the front edges of the jig (top and bottom plates) are bevelled so that you can get a better view of what is happening when sharpening, and keep using felt pen marker to check your progress.

Isn't it nice when something works!

Robin